12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Researching is it possible to upgrade early ( 2" shoes) 12 bolt drum brakes to the newer heavy duty brakes ( JB 5 brake option) found on later 12 bolts. Believe, the backing plates would need to be changes out. Specifications for 1979 K10, with the JB5 option for 12 bolts were provided to me by member Keith Seymore, below. Thanks Keith. Thinking of using the '79 specifications, because the front axle will be a '79 Dana 44 with the heavy duty/JB5 brake option. A more general question previously on 12 bolt brakes, has been asked in the 67 to 72 forum, by Lostmy65 in an older thread..

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

So directly from the '79 brake chart for a K10 JB5:

Drum - 359492; size is 283.2mm x 69.8mm
Wheel cylinder - 18004890 (diameter is 23.8mm)
Master Cylinder w/Boost - 18004252 (Delco Moraine, 28.57 mm dia); optional Bendix M/C = "KP"; booster = tandem vacuum 18003681
Combination Valve - 18002887: metering = 517 kPa, split point 1379 kPa, slope = .41
Backing plate:
Flange plate & brake asm LH = 14009889
Flange plate & brake asm RH = 14009890

The 69.8 mm is 2.75 inches. And 283.2 is about 11.15 inches.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Yep. I'm in the process of doing this myself. As you guessed, you'll need the later backing plates, but the brake offset (distance from axle flange to housing end) is the same.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Rod is correct. Just get the later model backing plates, then everything else is available at the parts store. This is a simple and effective upgrade. I might even have a spare set of those backing plates.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Rod and Carl thanks for the conformation, that this swap works. Sounds like you have done it with good results.



Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

What would you do for drums and 6 lug? be a nice upgrade on my 66. Would you use a K10 drum?
Jimmy

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Almost all braking (75-80%) is done by the front brakes. Changing the rears is more cosmetic than functional.
Fade under continual use is another story.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Yep.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Jimmy,

As Rod said, will use the K10 drums.
Their may be certain Suburbans up to 91 that have this brake package also, would have to confirm this. Have a '89 Suburban "C10" complete front suspension , including brakes and crossmember that have JB5 brakes. Could check these later Surburbans and see if their rear drums are the same part number as '79 K10.

And as said above doing this as a whole brake system upgrade to the optional heavy duty "JB5" brake option, as this is a super braking package, GM designed.

L



Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Les

I replied to your PM, just saw it sorry it took so long to respond.

Karl

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Continuing to research this upgrade, and found the brake shoe frame design chaned in '78. The size of the lining and drum stayed the same. However, '77 and older used a different brake shoe frame design, along with likely different internal parts too. The holes in the brake shoe frame are different between '77 and older, and '78 and up.
Still researching if their are differences in backing plates between '72 and Earlies 80s, along with C and K vehicles.

Jimmy, using K drums for 6 lugs.

L

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Interesting and good information!

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

I looked into this some more too. All the parts of the brake system are the same part numbers EXCEPT for the shoes. The wheel cylinders, drums and hardware kits are all the same. Here is a pic of the backing plates with shoes and hardware that I believe are from a 1977 pickup.
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/i...psyhbqgenj.jpg

Best as I can tell the '78 up shoes are missing the two smaller holes seen in the shoe frame in the pic above. All the hardware attachment holes appear to be the same. The parts store did not have the '77 shoes in stock, but had the '78 shoes and here is a pic of those:
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/i...psney6jjdg.jpg

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Improvement is improvement. I've done this upgrade on my 68 & 64 after realizing how easy the swap was. I would also upgrade the front brakes on a 81-87 if it only had the 1" vs 1.25" thick rotors.

Common place to find the correct backing plates is under Blazers or burbs that are getting parted out.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Finished up my swap today. Those are the "JB5" 11-5/32" x 2-3/4" drums on a narrowed '65 GM Truck 12-bolt. I used C10 rather than K10 drums, as I went to a 5 on 5" bolt pattern.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y20...h_P1230412.jpg

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

I've done this upgrade as well. Truck isn't on the road so...

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Scott, Rod, and NDS,

Thanks for the comments. Rod like the true pizza cutter wheels, had not thought of them, good idea, sort of substitute for a lift to work on underside stuff.

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Thanks. Those are a stand-in to help determine the final tire size.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Karl,

Opened box today and everything is great! Thank you.

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

you are welcome. Glad I could help.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

A few photos of the backing plate, for reference. Did not see any part number on them.

Karl thought the backing plates are from a 1977 truck with a 12 bolt and heavy duty, JB 5 brake option. The last photo show a '79 brake shoes set on them, and looks like these shoes should work fine. FYI, these brake shoes were used from '78 to at least 87, maybe longer,

The difference in the brake shoe frame holes are not an issue, as Karl had speculated, for '77 and down vs '78 and up from what I see.

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Those cleaned up nice.

How did the new shoes compare to the one old set I sent you with the backing plates? Can you get some side by side photos of them from both sides?

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Karl,

Good idea, will get some photos.

Yes they are cleaning up nice, thanks.

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

This is on my list of things to do, once I have the '70 back on the road. I plan to load it heavy from time to time, so better rear brakes will be an asset.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

So I guess the backing plates are offset more to the inside and the shoes are 3/4" wider as well as the drums?

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Yes. Does not change the overall width of the axle.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Karl,

Finally got the side by side photos, took me forever to get the work bench cleaned off!!! Let me know if more photos will help.
The '79 brake shoes are on the left and the '77 brake shoes are on the right. The lining material area is the same on both. The size specification are the same for both. They do have different part numbers. The brake shoe frames are made a little different, however, both sets of shoes, mounting hardware and emergency brake fit the '77 backing plate. The '79 brake shoe frame is a little thicker then the '77. The '77 frame has double material at the top, which you can see in later photos. The holes in the frames are also a little different, however, those used for this application are the same - so no matter. Also, more information is provided in above posts.

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

A few more photos. In the second photo you can see additional material added at the top of the '77 brake shoes. Photo three shoes the '79 without this additional layer, however, the frame material is thicker then the '77.

Les



Attachment 1491513

Attachment 1491514

Attachment 1491516

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

That's what I thought was the difference between the years. So, the later model shoes will work and fit in place of the 76-77 shoes with no issues. It appeared to be a manufacturing/engineering change to the frame and not to the actual lining. The frame change on the shoe would have made them quicker and less expensive to produce those parts.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

OYes, that is correct, from what I can see.

Note: The brake drums for this application are a LOT bigger, then the smaller two inch ones that came on the '65 12 bolt.

Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Going to dredge up an older thread here, but I was wondering where someone could buy the backing plates? I can get every part from the auto store, except the backing plates. Any info is appreciated.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Not sure if new ones are available? Lots of them should be available on trucks, subs and blazers being parted out with 12 bolt rears. Also, could post a WTB request in the parts section. Not sure when first used, '77 to '87 trucks and '91 subs/ blazer could have them. A key way to identify vehicles, that have these backing plates is to look for 1 1/4 inch wide front rotors, they are the JB5 brake package.

Hope this helps,
Les

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

If you're in a wrecking yard, the easy way to spot the HD brake option is the much larger/wider drums when peeking under the vehicle.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Thank you for the information.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

So just to confirm that these will work on pre-70.5 (narrow axle) trucks as well? I have searched and googled and know they WILL work with anything 70.5-87 (wide axle). Can't find anything confirming fitment on narrow axles.

I have an 87 Blazer setup I'd like to install on my 69.

Thanks in advance.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Correct. It will be a bolt-on upgrade for your '69.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

" Correct. It will be a bolt-on upgrade for your '69. "


Sweet. Thanks racecougar!

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Hope to find a set up in the bone yard

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

Correct.

Re: 12 Bolt Drum Brake Upgrade
 

I know this is an old thread but i need help I NEED a set of backing plates for my 12 bolt with the 2.75 inch wide shoes. Where can i buy these backing plates. I had a guy send me a set off of these off of this site and i JUST found out they are for the 2 inch wide shoes. nothing will line up. I'm in desperate need of these backing plates. Help me find a set