Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I'm considering fuel injection for the '87Lowrider.

The motor is a '76 454 with a stock rotating assy, good size cam, rebuilt heads and a host of other items. It's got about 8500 miles on it.

I'd like not to have to take out a loan to do this and don't see much here on the forum where others have already done this...

I've thought about holley and remember seeing other FI options on powerblock but haven't done much research yet.

Anyone know what my options are?

Thanks in advance!!

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Holley
Edelbrock
Fast EZ EFI
MSD
Megasquirt/DIY
OE GM TBI

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

That's quite a list... thanks!

I've already started checking out some of them... $3k-$5k for a complete system.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Keep an eye out for quality used systems if you want to save a bit.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I seen a slick TBI system in summit the other day $1600 the cool thing was it was fitted into a Holley carb body sensors were mounted into the fuel bowls. Kinda a cool system. PFS-70026

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Yep, that's the Professional Products TBI injection. Professional Products are made in China......need I say more?

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

If you're resourceful, you should look into the Megasquirt. Its not plug and play, but you have alot more options. You can get the ECU for as little as $150, and you build the mechanical stuff out of Junkyard parts, or order all off the shelf parts. The Megasquirt forum is very helpful, although its kind of information overload. I Have an MS-II ECU that I'm hoping to eventually use on an LS motor.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Actually you could.

That system works quite well for the price. I have setup a few of them, one for 383 making a dyno'd 450hp and the other a 650hp 427 BBC. Both run perfectly fine.

Besides just because something has Made In The USA on it doesn't mean the parts weren't made elsewhere and put together here.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

What few Professional Products parts I have had my hands on were of less that acceptable quality IMO. Granted, I have not touched their injection system, but I really don't think I would waste my money on one, knowing it is made entirely in China, and with my past experience with their products.

And I do understand that not every component in a 'Made in USA' product is made in the USA. But I would rather spend my money with a company that is based in the USA, and that stands behind their products should a problem arise.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Humbly, I have Edelbrock's first and second gen Pro Flo series experience. I have no dyno experience, only 6 years of shade tree set up and diagnostic experience. I have found that the Pro Flo is an expensive but decent multi-port full management system. But I had issues with their ignition system (their fault), electrical (my fault), and fuel system (both). If I had an option I would go with a stand alone ignition system over a full management system.

-steve

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I've put quite a bit of money into the top end of the motor with rebuilt heads, cam and carb. I also installed MSDs Pro Billet Dizzy and ignition w/ HVC regulator. I've seen some systems that are fuel management and assume you can use your own ignition system. I don't have enough research in yet to know the ins and outs of mixed matched systems but I'll keep reading...

Thanks for all the thoughts guys... you're always the best!!

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

The MSD Atomic EFI is similar to Professional Products TBI. All-in-one EFI system built into the the TB. Good price point too. It will also control timing as well. Made in the USA. And in some cases can be used returnless. The only reason I didn't buy one for my last swap was because they aren't offering a TPS output with it, so I'd have to add an external TPS for an electronic trans, which I think is a stupid hack. I've already asked MSD support to consider including TPS output in a future version.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

cool... thanks for the input!!

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I have a fast ez efi on my burb. Love it. Started and ran great at first turn of the key. The master kit with pump and hoses and fittings can be had for under 2000 if you shop around. I got mine price matched from atlanticspeed threw summit. Will never look back.

p.s. I went from 7 mpg with carb to 14 mpg. I suck at tuning carbs.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

wow.. I'll look into that option some.. my main concern is what I'd will have to change on the motor (cam, existing MSD ignition, heads, intake, etc) to use something like that.


Ken

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

As long as cam produces 9 inchs of vaccum the efi will work. It is made to bolt on to any motor with a flange for a 4 barral manifold. 4, 6, 8, and maybe 10 cylinders. All it needs is a rpm siganal. That is it. You tell it how many cylinders it has and dipplacement and what idle speed you want and air fuel ratios you want and turn key. Works on my lq4 with a cam.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

It does not control the ignition at all. It only needs a rpm input from the msd box. Like the tack signal wire.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Holley system has to be the best as its turbo/blower/NOS ready, many of the similar system like fast can't do that.
Even if you don't plan on it, the Holley system is ready for anything you can toss at it and it can auto tune it for you.

fast does look cool with the low mounted injectors but can't handle mods.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

It cant do forced induction. It can do nos with carefull tuning. That is the only thing i dont like. There is a guy on ls1tech with a procharger but not sure how he is doing it. But it can handle 600 hp single and 1200 with duels. I seen the msd system at goodguys resently and it looks like a great system. It can also control timing which is a nice feature. If i was to buy again i would look at the msd and fast. I dont like the holley because the injectors are above the throttle. Just a fancy tbi in my mind.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

better talk to a Holley tech, it can do forced, in our long talks he even suggested using both a turbo and a little NOS for "cooling" ;) asuring me it will do the majority of the work, so I don't have to be a tune expert.

http://www.jegs.com/p/Holley/Holley-...93117/10002/-1

http://www.jegs.com/i/Holley/510/558-304/10002/-1

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

You're not alone in that line of thought....

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I agree to but after lots of research, others of the same price can't handle as many mods, or it would be faast hands down for the below the plate injectors.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I do plan on injecting mine in the future, and I'm convinced that the FAST EZ-EFI is the one for me. The only other one I think I'd consider is the Atomic EFI from MSD, but I have a hard time buying an ignition company's first try at a fuel injection system. Plus, a lot of it's appeal is the returnless fuel system that is accomplished by cycling the fuel pump on and off which I'm sure is not good for the longevity of the pump.

One thing the MSD does really have over the FAST is that it controls timing, and a lot of the injection guys say that is very important. Although, FAST has been around the block a time or two, and I'm sure they have a pretty good handle on things.

My vote is FAST!

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

ive used a few of the systems mentioned here but by far the one i was happiest with on a 468 big block was the fast xfi

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Whew!

Great discussion...

So, it's between Fast, MSD and Holley.

Have any of you had problems with what I'm calling "Vapor Locking".. some say its a myth, I understand the theory and believe that's whats happening to me. I've tried everything I can think of, but when my temp gets over 190 (stop and go driving), I know it won't be long before the engine just fizzles out and I either have to pump it like crazy to get it going above 40-50 for a bit till it clears it throat or sometime it just strands me for a few minutes until it cools off. Then it's fine till the next time. Kinda frustrating considering the money I've put in it.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Change your ICM, they go flakey with heat when bad.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

My motor runs at 195-210. Never have issues. My old 350 did that in denver colorado. It almost crapped out in the middle of a very busy intersection on my way to a consert. Just bearly made it acrost. Never with new motor even with the carb.

I do wish fast could control the spark. They make a ignition to run my ls motor and there is no way for the ez efi to control it. That is the only reason i like the msd set up.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

icm?

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Ignition Control Module

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Good thread. I'm stuck between adding fuel injection to my 454 or wanting to go the LS motor route. Maybe this make my mind up.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Not if you look at the pic i posted. Aftermarket efi on ls motor..... I was really confused.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Well my thing is the 454 is perfectly fine so I don't want to pull it out. And I'm planning on replacing the 350/NP 203 combo that came in the truck with a 700R4/NP 205 combo first. But that FAST EZ EFI does look like a good choice.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I'm using a MSD Digital 6 with an HVC Regulator and Pro billet dizzy. Doesn't that digital 6 control ignition?

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

does the MSD get some air? even they can go funky, why they run two boxes on a NASCAR to switch over.

vapor lock happened to the big GM cars with AC in hot climates where underhood temps could melt lead, and they fixed it by using a block pump with a return line.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Anything can fail. When there's that much $$ riding on it, it pays to have a duplicate back-up. DUPLICATE, not alternative..... That should indicate something.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

i've been doing some researching on my own over the last few months on adding fuel injection to my suburban and i've narrowed it down to FAST ez efi and MSD atomic efi. I am not close to pulling the trigger on anything yet so I am still looking to see what people have to say about each system. I've heard great things about FAST's products and I know MSD has some quality stuff too. I want to hear more about real world usage of MSD's system just because it's so new, but early indicators show nothing but positives from it. I think MSD's system is easier to install but I really don't think a guy could go wrong either way.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Great info.. I'm going to do an EFI system on the '87 sometime this year. I hate not being able to take it out for a lengthy cruise without wondering when it's going to get over 200 degrees and die until it cools down. As long as I'm above 40mph, I'm good. It's when I drive in town, light to light where I have the problem. I have a BeCool radiator and Flex-a-lite electric fan setup that works great at highway speeds.

I'm also in the middle of a rebuild on my '57 stepper too so time is challenge.


Ken

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

I have somewhat changed my direction from my previous post. I found a good deal on a lightly used FAST throttle body complete with injectors and sensors (the one from the EZ-EFI kit) from the FAST test dyno on ebay. So now I'm going to build a MegaSquirt-II v3.0 ecu and a wiring harness to control the throttle body.

Definitely labor intensive, and still not cheap, but I hope to have ~$1,100.00 in my system, and the ecu will be fully programmable, easily modified in the future for whatever I want, it will control the ignition timing, and includes a real time barometric pressure correction. Plus I hope to learn a TON about fuel injection by building my own system.

Using a megasquirt type system and junkyard TBI parts, you could probably inject a motor for $500 or so.

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

Good Luck... I'm going to investigate MSD a little bit more, primarily to see if any of my existing MSD ignition system will work with their EFI setup. I've got a bunch of bucks tied up in a dizzy, regulator and ignition box that I'd rather not have to scrap if not absolutely necessary.


Kenny

Re: Fuel Injection for my 454
 

If your EFI system is a full management system utilizing an ignition amplifier you will be able splice in, bypass the amplifier, and use your MSD ignition box and CDI system.