Boppa's old yeller truck

[Low Elco]

Originally Posted by sduckworth13

Chip, I might have missed it but did you check the pinion angle and even if the pinion angle is right, the yolk might pulled out or pushed in too far from lowering it. I'm guessing its the driveshaft. Does the driveshaft make any clunk noises? I'm not a professional or qualified shade tree mechanic but, I was having the same issues with my 67 gmc when I lowered it 4/6.
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Yoke has proper clearance, about 5/8 back from bottomed. Angle is getting rechecked this weekend. No clunk. We pulled the shaft and shut the motor off and pulled it 65 mph on a strap, still throb. Been on the horn with Oreilly about swapping us out for new. Well see.
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[Xeen]

Originally Posted by Low Elco

Yoke has proper clearance, about 5/8 back from bottomed. Angle is getting rechecked this weekend. No clunk. We pulled the shaft and shut the motor off and pulled it 65 mph on a strap, still throb. Been on the horn with Oreilly about swapping us out for new. Well see.
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Ya know an easy way to figure this out is change the rear axle out with a known good one and see if the vibration dissapears, I'm sure you know someone in KC that has one that would be willing to help you out.

[litew8]

Did you ever replace inner/outter tie rods?

[litew8]

Another question might be: Were the wheels balanced before or after Boppa changed brake parts? I'd almost be willing to bet the tires weren't balanced right, or, not to the correct spec.

[Low Elco]

After, I think. I know we just did the new wheel here recently, but we had a whole different set of rims on in that period. Got all new Brake hoses, bearings, seals and rotors last night. We shall see. Tierods check out good, using the cheater bar test. that's the only thing that hasn't been replaced.

[litew8]

Okay, so you've had different rims on it and it still vibrates. Were all of the rims balanced from the same shop? I thought I had read in your thread that you had the wheels balanced and then soon after Boppa went in and changed the brake parts due to noticing the vibration. I said I'd be almost willing to bet because I'm not a gambling man. Just need to determine what happened or changed right before he worked on the brakes. The only thing I noticed that you had written up was the balancing to .5 and asked if it was kosher or not.

[Low Elco]

Originally Posted by litew8

Okay, so you've had different rims on it and it still vibrates. Were all of the rims balanced from the same shop? I thought I had read in your thread that you had the wheels balanced and then soon after Boppa went in and changed the brake parts due to noticing the vibration. I said I'd be almost willing to bet because I'm not a gambling man. Just need to determine what happened or changed right before he worked on the brakes. The only thing I noticed that you had written up was the balancing to .5 and asked if it was kosher or not.

OK-He got the truck at Labor Day, and noticed like a small tire vibe. He thought it might be brakes. He did the brakes, all new stuff. Still vibe, and now throb (what we're chasing) as well. He put the wheels on that were on during the build, that have been on for the 12+ years we've owned the truck, and were fine when we took them off. Still throb. Had all 4 new tires balanced and found bent wheel. Ran the old rims for quite a while while chasing other things, as they are a known quantity. Still throb. Put rear rims off LBT (ok on LBT) on rear for a test. No change in throb. Painted up another replacement wheel and had it balanced to .5 (pretty good!). Put new rallies on again. Still throb. All stuff , everything, attached to frame in rear checked/replaced. New shocksx4. New bushings and balljoints in front. Steering box and Pitman replaced under a year ago. Tie rod ends check out ok.

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by Low Elco

He put the wheels on that were on during the build, that have been on for the 12+ years we've owned the truck, and were fine when we took them off. Still throb. Had all 4 new tires balanced and found bent wheel. Ran the old rims for quite a while while chasing other things, as they are a known quantity. Still throb. Put rear rims off LBT (ok on LBT) on rear for a test. No change in throb. Painted up another replacement wheel and had it balanced to .5 (pretty good!). Put new rallies on again. Still throb.

About a year ago, the wife's Jeep developed a highway vibration. Bad enough even she complained which she normally doesn't. Took it to NTB and had all four tires balanced, vibration was still there. So we took it to a Jeep dealer thinking the problem might be CV joints or who knows. They called and said tires are out of balance. No way, I tell them, just had them redone. They said they use a Hunter "Road Force" balancer and their tech was sure it would cure the problem. Okay, I tell them, but if it doesn't, I ain't paying for the balance job. When I drove it after they completed the work, to my amazement the vibe was completely gone. Not sure how you're having the tires balanced, but I've come to believe not all balancers are created equal. Having said that, I'd be surprised if after all the different combos you've tried that the issue is tire/wheel.

I mentioned previously that when I was chasing the problem with mine, I set up a little experiment...

• Jacked up the rear of the truck and put a couple of stands under the frame.
• Used the floor jack to raise the rear end to just shy of lifting off the stands.
• Had the wife start the truck and set speedo on 65 where vibe was worst.
• I could see the rear axle vibrating and the bed/rear fenders also.
• Took the tires/wheels off both sides and ran lug nuts down to hold brake drums.
• Repeated the test with the speed set on 65, no change.
• Removed the driveshaft and used an electric drill to spin the pinion yoke. Still no change.
• Removed the brake drums and spun it up again. No change.

At this point the rear axle was still vibrating noticeably. So I then removed the entire assembly, straightened the axle tubes, put in a new posi and R/P and relocated the shocks to an upright configuration. All of which is documented on my build thread. The results were very good. The ride improved dramatically and the vibration was reduced significantly. Not 100% gone, but much less of an annoyance. I felt that in my case, the shocks were probably a key factor, but I know you've relocated yours also. I keep hoping you'll find something I've overlooked.

[Low Elco]

Did nearly the exact same experiment both in my garage and on a lift at the trans shop. Couldn't find any major throb at target speed. Nothing like indicated on the road, anyway. After the wholesale rearend swap, and continuing throb which was reduced with the new shocks and a bit of the throb feel now in the steering wheel, I went forward. Was this road force balancer at the NTB on 169? I may try that as well.
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[litew8]

Went back and read some more. Copy/Paste the turn of events.

8-28
It's ALIVE! Messed with TV cable and got it to shift beautifully.
Ran up and put gas in it and got out on the hwy and ran uP to 80 ish.
Runs real nice!

8-31
Had boys out last night in it, tires are smoothing out, it'll be a nice hi way cruiser.
Settled in good at 75-80

9-2
burbling along at 82 mph, no problems.
We may get to drop it yet, we think due to the frame straightening the alignment is wonky, but not terrible.

9-4
Boppa went to have the tires balanced and found a bent rim!

9-22
the front brakes won't release.
Boppa has done new bearings and rotors and bled the fronts.
I think the prop valve is stuck.

10-1
Boppa redid the brakes, and he thinks the bearings were just too tight.

10-15
Biggest issue is a Throbbing vibration at around 60-65.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Did Boppa get into an accident he's not telling you about?
Maybe your aluminum cab bushing spacers are transfering vibration to the cab.


..
all I got

[Vic1947]

Originally Posted by Low Elco

Did nearly the exact same experiment both in my garage and on a lift at the trans shop. Couldn't find any major throb at target speed. Nothing like indicated on the road, anyway. After the wholesale rearend swap, and continuing throb which was reduced with the new shocks and a bit of the throb feel now in the steering wheel, I went forward. Was this road force balancer at the NTB on 169? I may try that as well.
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No, I only went to the NTB in Liberty and apparently they didn't have the Hunter Road Force equipment. Balance job they did was a waste of $$. The place that fixed it was the Jeep dealer on N. Oak, north of Englewood. However, I had the truck tires done at NKC Brake Service on Swift Ave. I first found them doing a Google search. Try this link to find the one closest to you. It costs more than a conventional balance job, but the results are impressive. Be sure you get a before and after printout if you decide to go that route.

[Low Elco]

Originally Posted by litew8

Went back and read some more. Copy/Paste the turn of events.

8-28
It's ALIVE! Messed with TV cable and got it to shift beautifully.
Ran up and put gas in it and got out on the hwy and ran uP to 80 ish.
Runs real nice!

8-31
Had boys out last night in it, tires are smoothing out, it'll be a nice hi way cruiser.
Settled in good at 75-80

9-2
burbling along at 82 mph, no problems.
We may get to drop it yet, we think due to the frame straightening the alignment is wonky, but not terrible.

9-4
Boppa went to have the tires balanced and found a bent rim!

9-22
the front brakes won't release.
Boppa has done new bearings and rotors and bled the fronts.
I think the prop valve is stuck.

10-1
Boppa redid the brakes, and he thinks the bearings were just too tight.

10-15
Biggest issue is a Throbbing vibration at around 60-65.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Did Boppa get into an accident he's not telling you about?
Maybe your aluminum cab bushing spacers are transfering vibration to the cab.


..
all I got

The aluminum spacers are mounted in a sandwich between the urethane body mounts and the body. Shouldn't be an issue, works just like a million body lifts in 4x4's. But, hell, who knows. We had another guy suggest to loosen everything on the body up, shake it around and bolt it back down, which is in the next stage.

Thanks for the timeline.

No accident, same truck all these years. At Least it'd give me an excuse!

The last 2 posts of the timeline have lead me to where we are today. Floaty feel seems to have cured itself, but we've still gotta get it aligned. Early vibes were just tire buzz, no biggie. The throb is enough to shake your beer gut in time with it. Brakes/bearings seemed to check ok, but who knows. Thanks for the recap, been kinda wanting to do it myself.

I am intrigued with the Road Force balancing. Jeep Dealer, eh? Might make a coupla calls. This weekend may be a bit crowded to get rolling on this, but I'll give 'er a shot. I've still gotta get it reassembled and aligned.

[Low Elco]

Hmm, come to find out there's one literally around the corner from Boppa.

KC Complete Auto Service
451 NE 94th St
KANSAS CITY, MO 64155
Phone: 816-454-6000
Approx. 18 miles from your location.

We'll have to see.

[Xeen]

Im sitting here trying to figure out what would cause a vibration only under the full weight of the vehicle but not on a lift, that is interesting, im going to have to think on this awhile.
What was the result of checking the ballance of the front rotors?
Im sitting here thinking to myself wouldnt it just beat all if this ends up only being a poor wheel ballancing job?

[Low Elco]

Welcome to my world. The dynamic load is what's driven me to the front end.

Tried to do that, guy says they can't get them on the machine. Machine shop guy is down to balance them for $25 ea. OReilly's swapped the rotors out for me.

Called the shop, they're down to align it. The balancing with the road force is $25 a wheel, this better be one smooth mother! The guy says it really works wonders.
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[jlsanborn]

Props to Litew8 for the run down! Elco is a great contributor to this site so it's cool to see some cheese going his way. Vic's post was great too! You guys rock .

I'm hopeful that the alignment shows something that was overlooked and can be easily corrected.

[Low Elco]

Originally Posted by jlsanborn

Props to Litew8 for the run down! Elco is a great contributor to this site so it's cool to see some cheese going his way. Vic's post was great too! You guys rock .

I'm hopeful that the alignment shows something that was overlooked and can be easily corrected.

Contributor, shoveler of massive amounts of BS- you decide.

I just wanna see this roll nice for Boppa. Like my parts guy said, it's gonna be something simple and stupid.
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[litew8]

"The aluminum spacers are mounted in a sandwich between the urethane body mounts" right

[Low Elco]

Originally Posted by Low Elco

So, we were presented with the gift of a low 90's day today. So, I took advantage of it. I called the local metal supplier and had them cut 2 1/2" round alum. bar stock 1/2" thick. Then I drilled 'em out here at the house. Many thanks to the lovely Wife, who picked them up on her way home. Then, we loosened up the cab and core suppport bolts, picked the whole shebang up one side at a time with a floorjack and voila! Instant bodylift! Lined up just great. We also squared up the body on the frame a tad and bolted 'er down for hopefully the last time. Looked so good, we didn't like the passenger fender fit, so we added some shims. Much better now. Really wish the core support was a good bit further forward, but we'll see how it comes out. Crapped out for tonight. Here's the pics-

Drilling the spacers-
Attachment 963950

Main mount fit-
Attachment 963952

Back mount fit-
Attachment 963953

Final alignment-
Attachment 963951

Mai the Wonderdog sez- It's good!
Attachment 963954

Supposedly hot as blazes tomorrow. Checking stuff off of the looooong list, but hey, this was a biggie, and I'm glad it came out as well as it did. Thanks for playin' along!

Ummm, sandwiched between the urethane body mounts and the body. Post 210, pg. 9.
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[litew8]

I know, I saw the pictures. Metal on metal (frame/spacer) instead of metal on rubber, or rather, harder urethane. It's just a guess.

[Low Elco]

Hmmmm... Ok, so I got out in the shop this morning intending to pop the rotors back together and change brake hoses. Admittedly, I had just whipped the brakes apart and run for it, it's been a busy week. So, I had just left everything dirty and gone.

So, today I get meticulous. I get started cleaning the spuds on the spindle up and find a lot of wear on the passenger side. Now, there's a bit of wear that you can kinda feel on the driver's side, but the passenger's has a step in it. By rough caliper measurement, it's .008 smaller top to bottom and .oo4 side to side than the rest of the shaft at the outer bearing surface. Hrmmm... Gonna have to hit the yard, methinks. The new bearing goes right on the used drop spindles I have on the shelf, nice and tight, no rock. Pretty sloppy on this one, a little wiggle on the driver's. So, we'll see. At least I found something funky. Maybe one of these funky things I fix will be the one!

Wide shot-you can see the wear area.


Tried to get a close up of the underside- that's where the step is. Sorry it's bit fuzzy, but you can see the step in the shaft. We'll have to find a good'un!

[litew8]

[Low Elco]

Keep eatin', it's too damn cold for me to try the yards today! Schnikies!
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[Xeen]

Ok well I can tell you for sure that a tore up spindle shaft will cause vibration so I think you found the culprit, I dont know why but I assumed you were on new spindles so I didn't even consider that as a possible problem.
You dont have to go to the junk yard, call "Bobs Vintage Truck Parts" at 913-634-1697, hes in Lenexa and will hook you up, he has a huge selection and low prices, Tell him Brian from Topeka refered you.

[litew8]

Is that the same side the bent rim was on?