05-10-2018, 09:46 AM | #51 | |
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Re: Alternator question
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05-10-2018, 09:53 AM | #52 |
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Re: Alternator question
I think you are correct. You need to feed that factory junction and you use the old alternator wire to do it, unless you get rid of the factory junction and attach those various wires to your new junction block. If you wired them individually to your new junction block, you may need to extend each wire or replace some if the wires, because some may not be quite long enough.
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05-10-2018, 10:08 AM | #53 | |
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Re: Alternator question
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This should be a non issue, since I left my junction unmolested. Right? Or, if this is a reference to the other junction, the one by the battery - I'm leaving those wires alone as well. |
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05-10-2018, 12:33 PM | #54 |
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Re: Alternator question
DJ, you said 2 grounds on the alternator. Can I use the factory one that goes to the fender by the junction, and just add a 10 gauge to where the fans ground, or should both be heavier?
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05-10-2018, 01:33 PM | #55 |
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Re: Alternator question
No the reference is to the new junction. I had to separate the old junction wires because the alternator is now on the passenger side of the engine. I replaced my alternator output wire with an 8 gauge wire wire so I didn't need the old output wire for that, but I used it to power my coolant fan. My battery charge wire and the cab feed wire were long enough to reuse. One wire I forgot to mention is the black/white 18 gauge wire for the ammeter. It was soldered into the old factory junction so I just connected it to the new terminal with the alternator and battery charge and the ca feed wires.
The other ammeter wire that connects on the right fender junction runs straight to the cab firewall block and then straight to the cluster plug to termina 12. I ran it to to the terminal strip to a separate terminal and continued it from there to the cluster plug. It is much easier to separate the old soldered, or crimped junction, wires and just do away with it. I am sure the wires aren't going to reach the junction so I would unwrap the harness and just use the one's you can and replace the rest after you reroute all of them then you can retape all the wires for a clean look. Just remember that all the wires you connect to your junction will be full time hot, and any keyed on hot wires like ignition and start and accessories will require a different junction or switch. It doesn't matter which wires you connect to the junction, they will all be connected together.I would connect the alternator output, cab feed and alternator sensing wire, to one big lug, and the battery charge wire, and fan power wires to the other big lug.Then you have the smaller terminals to use for other relays.The brown exciter wire for the alternator to no. 1 on the alternator has to be keyed on power so, it will need to run to a separate connection or else straight to the alternator if it is long enough.
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05-10-2018, 04:02 PM | #56 |
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Re: Alternator question
Thanx.
That would be better, vette, but I've decided not to mess with the junction as it works and my solder, electric skills are such that I'm not inclined to mess with stuff that works So, my ammeter should be good as is. My new output will go to the terminal. The old output, that I cut by the alternator and that is still hooked to the junction will also go to the terminal bolt to send power to the cab. My fans, I'm running them to the hot terminal that I'm adding, but the switch must be wired to interrupt the ground, because they were straight on my battery and still needed a switch to work. I've finished the 2 wires to the terminals, and made the wires for the other stuff, but time is limited, so I haven't got past that yet. They are all fused as you instructed. |
05-10-2018, 09:54 PM | #57 |
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Re: Alternator question
You're getting there.
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05-11-2018, 06:09 PM | #58 |
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Re: Alternator question
Worked on it some today. The fan power wires that went to the battery now go across the radiator ready for the terminal (yellow connectors).
The power for the a/c fan that went to the junction by the battery has joined them. Also put in the fusible link. The alternator is in and wired up. In addition to the ground it had, I sent another 10 gauge to the frame. Having trouble drilling holes for the terminal, it's tight down there. So that's it for today. |
05-15-2018, 07:10 PM | #59 |
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Re: Alternator question
Ok, here we go. Finished the wiring today. Did a test start. Everything still needs to be taped up and routed, but I wanted a test run. Here are the numbers.
Good - I hope - Please! Before starting - 12.47v Idle no accessories - 14.84v Idle everything on - 13.04v 1500 rpm everything on 14.88v So it's charging - not too high I hope? The ammeter works correctly as well, showing heavy charge right after starting,then settling down just above center. Also moved up when everything turned on, then settled as well. Here are some pics of the terminal strip. I ran the power from alternator and power to cab to the bottom bolt. The radiator fans are on the top. The a/c fan is in the middle. I can't thank you DJLambert and Vette enough. No way without the help. P.S. I reread all the posts and see that I asked questions already answered etc. Thank you for your kind patience! Oh, the blue box will cover the thing for extra protection when done. Dave Last edited by dave`12; 05-15-2018 at 07:15 PM. |
05-15-2018, 07:28 PM | #60 |
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Re: Alternator question
Very good. What is the function of that blue box thingy?
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05-15-2018, 07:36 PM | #61 |
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Re: Alternator question
I was sweating the numbers being too high. Thanx.
The box will cover the terminal - keep weather and stuff from touching the posts and shorting something out. If you look at my picture in post #58,you will see the same box (but painted and cut to fit) covering my fan relays. |
05-15-2018, 09:53 PM | #62 |
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Re: Alternator question
Pat yourself on the back for a job well done, and just think of all the guys we've helped with this thread.
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05-19-2018, 10:57 AM | #63 |
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Re: Alternator question
I’m late to this convo but for future reference for guys doing a similar swap-I’ve got a lot of experience swapping late model alternators into all kinds of vintage GM stuff. You have to realize it isnt just about total amps that make the CS alternators superior to SI style ones its mainly about the regulator voltage output speed being MUCH faster to react to changes in voltage drop-and the CS alts shed heat much better. Size wise there is ONE direct fit CS alternator that fits the v-belt setups-simply swap pulleys but retain the CS cooling fan. Application is a 1988 Olds Firenza with a 2.0 FI (122cu) engine.
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05-19-2018, 11:27 AM | #64 | |
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Re: Alternator question
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05-19-2018, 11:53 AM | #65 |
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Re: Alternator question
Its already 12 and 6. No re-clocking needed.
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05-27-2018, 11:43 AM | #66 |
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Re: Alternator question
You guys are bumming me out. Just finished the SI and everyone telling me that I should have went CS.
At any rate, I still consider it a major upgrade, and everything seems to be working great. As an aside, I've been sick (shingles) so I haven't finished taping everything up. Will upload a pic when all that is done. Thanks again! |
05-27-2018, 12:12 PM | #67 |
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Re: Alternator question
The good thing is upgrading to a CS from an SI is far easier than going from externally regulated to SI anyway. The voltage regulator speed and overall heat disippation is far better. With regards to alternators, the newest style you can upgrade to the better!
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05-27-2018, 12:28 PM | #68 |
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Re: Alternator question
I don't think you should be bummed out. The conversion to 12SI is much clearer than CS. There is not a clear description anywhere of exactly what to do. This thread is as close as I've seen, but the information about an application didn't appear until after you bought the 12SI.
In order to be clear (for me), the instructions for CS conversion need to have:
Fortunately, it is not a very expensive project to experiment with, perhaps a couple hundred dollars for everything including a fresh Gates belt. Last edited by dmjlambert; 05-27-2018 at 12:31 PM. Reason: minor corrections and punctuation |
05-27-2018, 12:38 PM | #69 |
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Re: Alternator question
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...generator,2412
For this application it comes with the pulley. |
05-27-2018, 01:08 PM | #70 |
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Re: Alternator question
I’ve used that alternator for countless 67-72 GM A-body alternator upgrade kits (Chevelle, Monte carlo, Cutlass) and along with my upgraded and re-routed system wiring, I can measure 14.5V @ output post with car running and 14.4V @ an interior stock fuse panel BAT terminal with car running while having:
AC on high speed Headlights on Aftermarket stereo with multiple amps hitting hard Running the power windows up/down Interior courtesy lighting on I’ve proven over and over with those alternators that when properly supported in key areas using upgraded wiring, voltage loss is extremely minimal and amperage use is fairly low which is exactly as it should be. Part of my work was to also dispell the myth that people should always upgrade to the latest fuse panel blah blah blah that AAW and PAINLESS always try to push. |
05-29-2018, 10:29 AM | #71 |
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Re: Alternator question
Is the Firenza CS alternator a 3 wire or a 4 wire connection? OK , looking thru your links it appears to be 4 wire with me using the S terminal only???? I have no idiot light (L terminal ??) on my 67 K10 -- I have a voltage gauge only. Should I pay $33 for a 4 prong female plug?? To just use 1 terminal?? Does this appear to make it 2 wire not including ground ------ Bat and S terminal? Or do I still have to use the L term also with resistance? Blame dave12 for this. haha dave 12, Hope shingles are easing up --- been there. Got a shot and hope never to get again. Wish they had had chicken pox shots when I was young.
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05-29-2018, 12:07 PM | #72 |
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Re: Alternator question
The “L” still needs to go to your light circuit but I would still add a 150-200 ohm/1W resistor inline on it. The bigger red wire is still the voltage sensing lead too, then you have the big charge post cable to run.
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05-30-2018, 12:56 PM | #73 | ||||
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Re: Alternator question
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All you need is a glove or rag, a 15/16" socket and an impact gun to zip it off and zip the V-belt pulley on. If yiou don't have an impact then the alternator armature has a socket for an allen driver to hold it while turning the nut with an open end wrench. Here's the wiper error and the correction. ERROR: Wiper correction:
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05-31-2018, 11:44 AM | #74 |
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Re: Alternator question
I have changed the serpentine pulleys over to the V type and it is easy with the 15/16 socket and impact gun. The shafts though can be a little shorter and when you get the V pulley on the nut goes on barely flush. Also in the wrecking yards they charge extra for a separate V pulley so I figure any way I can get one without paying extra I'll take it. Portable impact guns are expensive but if I had one I'd do the swap right in the junk yard.
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06-11-2018, 02:01 AM | #75 |
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Re: Alternator question
Thanks Dave 12 for starting and Dmjlambert, VetteVet, Vince1, Gmachinz , enjoying everyones input and gave me the direction I want to do in my 1970 C10 CST alternator upgrade,
im gonna go with ACDelco 3351011 cs130 this already has vpulley mounted ACDelco PT2145, hopefully resistor correct now I am assuming this comes with a big enough resistor already in place, if someone knows for sure please chime in
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