Winter Caught Some Napping

[powerdriver]

Always a learning curve with winter driving . Road temps below freezing and a wet snow hammered into ice . Not a good day to be out .





No one hurt but the mini van stuck beside the truck


Why would anyone take a travel trailer out in this mess

[The Rocknrod]

People just don't get the "Slow Down" hint when driving in snow.

[Sheepdip]

I have a question for all of you who live in snow country....Out here in California the highways are very tightly controlled for tire chain installations, when and where the snow falls, including black ice.

In I believe it was January 1998 I was working in Princeton/Evansville Indiana on the Toyota plant being constructed at that time. Winter hit and it piled up with about a foot of snow, I went to the auto parts to get some tire chains for the company truck and they looked at me like I was totally out of my mind and proceeded to inform me that nobody uses those things.
I finally got them to order me a pair. I personally did make it to the jobsite everyday with no mishaps with rear tire chains, but it really amazed me how many people flew by at 70 mph only to be passed later piled up in a ditch or up a hill.

So why no tire chains for you snow country drivers?

[whitedog76]

Originally Posted by Sheepdip

I have a question for all of you who live in snow country....Out here in California the highways are very tightly controlled for tire chain installations, when and where the snow falls, including black ice.

In I believe it was January 1998 I was working in Princeton/Evansville Indiana on the Toyota plant being constructed at that time. Winter hit and it piled up with about a foot of snow, I went to the auto parts to get some tire chains for the company truck and they looked at me like I was totally out of my mind and proceeded to inform me that nobody uses those things.
I finally got them to order me a pair. I personally did make it to the jobsite everyday with no mishaps with rear tire chains, but it really amazed me how many people flew by at 70 mph only to be passed later piled up in a ditch or up a hill.

So why no tire chains for you snow country drivers?

I've been asked that before. Honestly, I can't say. I've driven in some pretty gnarly stuff, but never felt the need to run with chains. Our municipalities and the DOT do a pretty good job of clearing the roads. If it's bad enough that I need chains to get to work, I'll just stay home.

I've ran plow trucks for the DOT and for the local township. It had to be pretty bad before we even put chains on our equipment. About the only time we did was when we got the V plows out.

[pritch]

I can't speak for all, but in general I would say that we have better tires for it, and a basic experience for knowing how to deal with it. I have chains, but would rather get hit with a stick than put them on

[mongocanfly]

Around here , if and rarely when we get anything, it seems to be more ice than snow...I've driven thru 3ft snow drifts in Colorado mnts with no issues....but you put 1/8" of ice on our roads and you cant go nowhere.....but it seems everybody thinks they can run 75 on ice...never fails...

[special-K]

In most of California the snow only fails in higher altitudes. The chains requirement begins at a certain altitude. People never ran snow tires there before "all season" radials were introduced. And that's where the chain requirements were put into place. In places that get winter statewide, Snow tires were a requirement.. Now they just spread tons of salt and brine, run hundreds of plows, and people run at least all seasons.

This storm isn't just snow, it's snow, then sleet, then freezing rain. No tire is good for that. It's best to stay off the road. People don't run studded tires because the roads get cleared so fast anymore.

That storm is coming here tonight. I'll just sit it out. They drizzled the nasty brine on the big roads last night.

[Greasey Harley]

On the subject of chains, I have been on mountain roads, when chains were the ONLY way to stay on the road. Sometimes they are nesecary.
Usually good snow tires are sufficient. I run studded snow tires. Haven't put them on this season yet, though.

Just remember to slow down and give yourself more time when the roads are bad.

[Troy Sr]

I was born and raised in Montana, I also lived in Central Oregon for three years. We always had chains but never used them. They were only if we were required to have them on. Never had any problems flying off the road.

[Stocker]

In Nor. Calif where I live, it's not elevation but conditions that determine chain control. Sometimes it can snow fairly low, sometimes not. Most of the time the rules are strictly enforced. I recently had to go to town for a medical thingy and the ~ 1-hour drive home took well over 3 hours b/c a lot of people didn't think they needed to chain up and they somehow got around chain control. Made for a huge mess, we sat for well over an hour and then crawled along for miles.

Most of the time if you have 4WD with proper tires on all four, you don't need chains (but carry them). We had several inches of snow that time and by night, at home, at least 13 inches. We never spun a tire, including going up our steep little hill.

Some of the worst conditions I ever saw was decades ago in Missouri. An all-night ice storm covered everything in 1 to 3 inches of solid ice. It was an absolute disaster, many people who ventured out went off-roading.... unintentionally. I had a '71 Camaro with Michelins and a limited-slip diff and I got around safely, but very very slowly.

[FleetsidePaul]

I should probably get some chains. It doesn't snow much where I live. But we have our days. So far so good. My wife's little Subaru is all wheel drive. And while it may not look the part. It's pretty hard to stop it. Even with bad road conditions. It goes through pretty much anything without so much as spinning a tire. But I do plan on lifting it and getting some sort of off road type wheels and tires on it. Something that can handle bad roads and still be a daily driver.

I worry more about the other guy. People drive like idiots up here. Regardless of the weather. Something about putting a steering wheel in front of someone makes them lose their mind.

['63GENIII]

Originally Posted by FleetsidePaul

I should probably get some chains. It doesn't snow much where I live. But we have our days. So far so good. My wife's little Subaru is all wheel drive. And while it may not look the part. It's pretty hard to stop it. Even with bad road conditions. It goes through pretty much anything without so much as spinning a tire. But I do plan on lifting it and getting some sort of off road type wheels and tires on it. Something that can handle bad roads and still be a daily driver.

I worry more about the other guy. People drive like idiots up here. Regardless of the weather. Something about putting a steering wheel in front of someone makes them lose their mind.

X2 on the Subi.

My '63 does real well in snow and ice. 4wd feels real solid.

My 05 Forester XT drives like it was built for snow and ice. So much so that Id rather drive the XT before the truck and definitely before the Wife's Yukon in the mountains.

As far as the idiot drivers.... they're everywhere. Around here its mentally taxing trying to keep an eye on the jack weeds that travel the roads. And forget about inclement weather.... If their on board screen doesn't tell them what to do, they forget how to drive!

[special-K]

I sit out going down the road for work because of "the others". It rather lose a days pay (which would be compromised by the conditions anyway) than risk wrecking my truck I need to work out of everyday. Back in the early-'70s when people just stayed home and before all the 4wds I'd hop in my '56 Bug and go visit people. It was great having the road to myself, or only see people that knew they could handle it.

In the '50s & '60s when I was a young kid, and even my early days of driving in the '70s, people ran chains when it snowed and everyone had a pair of chunky tread snow tires they mounted for winter. Many had 6 wheels and tires. The main roads were marked "Snow Emergency Route" stating snow tires and/or chains were required. There were always the procrastinators who waited too long and got caught on the road in the first snow. Then the rush was on at the tire stores. I also remember on bigger hills there were drums of sand laid down to shovel from. Also, where drifting would occur the county and state roads would put up snow fence. Now they just seem to count of dumping tons of metal eating ingredients to get roads clear and dry ASAP. People don't know how to sit anything out in today's 24/7/365 world. Gotta have it all and gotta have it NOW! Can't be letting the wheels of progress slow. And that's why we have Dumb Dumb Ditch Drivers. Roads are 98% clear in hours after the snow stops. That 2% will still getcha doing 80 mph like it's July

[67C10Step]

My fellow Arkansans may chime in on this one but we tend to get a lot of ice and sleet in my area. The more hilly areas can get snow, like where I grew up in the Ozark Mountains.

For the most part almost any frozen precipitation is so infrequent it doesn't take much to mess things up and shut us down. Not to mention the state road department seems somewhat inept in clearing.

Seems at least half the folks in this state with jacked up 4x4's thinks the snow/ice isn't going to affect them. Still barreling down the road at 60+ mph. I've owned nothing but a 4x4 for years but I know it helps me go and doesn't help me in the stopping department.

I usually slow down to the point if I do slip off the road it's not a fire ball crash. Or, just stay at home and try to not get myself into trouble.

Stay warm, pack a good hat, coat, and gloves in case you are stranded or have to walk.

[GOPAPA]

Being reitired sure helps as to driving on icy roads,, I just stay home and when I do go out I try and avoid work traffic.. I,,, like others learned that stopping is about the same for everyone.. go slow and some times slide to a stop where you need to stop at..

BUT ! My whole area has been increased in population in the thousands and our road ways all around are not enough to support the amount of more cars and trucks .. and winter of course is the worst.

[special-K]

Steering is compromised on ice, too. Front tires can go straight when turned and tail ends can come around. Braking in both situations only makes it worse, but is the natural instinct. Steering into a fishtail might not do a thing either, if front tires are sliding. Just have to hope to find traction but FAST! If it's snow on the ground and ice on the road, your best bet is get your tires into the snow to slow and get a better grip. Definitely need to drive differently... or not at all.

[68panelman]

People in my area can't drive in perfect conditions, that seems to be everywhere nowadays, expecting them to put on tire chains, forgettaboutit.

[GOPAPA]

We now have studded tires ,,which work pretty good ,,better than bare tires that is

My dad used to put on Walnut Tread Tires ) the tires really had walnut shells embedded into the tread for grip

Also there were cork embedded into the tread area of the tires too..

[underliner6]

In a Colorado, there is two stages of traction requirement depending on road conditions: traction requirement and chain requirement

Traction laws often are in effect when there is winter weather. Under that law, no chains are needed if drivers have snow tires, four-wheel drive or all-wheel drive if there are 1/8 inch tread on tires.

When it gets worst, than all passenger vehicles must have chains on.

[Sheepdip]

Originally Posted by underliner6

In a Colorado, there is two stages of traction requirement depending on road conditions: traction requirement and chain requirement

Traction laws often are in effect when there is winter weather. Under that law, no chains are needed if drivers have snow tires, four-wheel drive or all-wheel drive if there are 1/8 inch tread on tires.

When it gets worst, than all passenger vehicles must have chains on.

Pretty much mirrored here in Kalifornia, also any trailer with brakes must have chains when chains are required.

[rpmerf]

There was a new policy that came out a couple years ago. Since I have the capability to work from home, I no longer get snow days. I'm expected to take my laptop home if it is expected to snow. If it is delayed, we come into the office late. I just take off. When we get let out early it is usually right after lunch. If it looks like we are getting let out early, I take off at the beginning of the lunch break to avoid the rush.

Most snows are only a couple inches. Might get 2-3 a year. Once every 10 years we get a 2 foot blizzard. I can get around most snows around here just fine, but I'd rather not go out unless I have a good reason for it. Not like I really leave the house much anyway. It's not me that i'm worried about, it's everyone else around me.

There seem to be 3 types of people. Extremely over-cautious, don't care, and somewhat level headed. Driving into work in the morning after a dusting of snow on the ground, there will always be someone in the left lane driving 35 mph with their hazards on while everyone else is doing 50+ mph around them just fine. Good luck getting around if you get stuck behind them. Most people don't change their driving habits for the snow. Anytime I venture out when there is a couple inches of snow, the streets are always full of people stuck that I need to maneuver around. I'll see people trying to get their FWD car out of the driveway, when the snow is up to their bumper. Where are they even expecting to go? With all the spray, salt, and plows, even my cul-de-sac is plowed within 2-3 days after a blizzard.

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Sheepdip

I have a question for all of you who live in snow country....Out here in California the highways are very tightly controlled for tire chain installations, when and where the snow falls, including black ice.

In I believe it was January 1998 I was working in Princeton/Evansville Indiana on the Toyota plant being constructed at that time. Winter hit and it piled up with about a foot of snow, I went to the auto parts to get some tire chains for the company truck and they looked at me like I was totally out of my mind and proceeded to inform me that nobody uses those things.
I finally got them to order me a pair. I personally did make it to the jobsite everyday with no mishaps with rear tire chains, but it really amazed me how many people flew by at 70 mph only to be passed later piled up in a ditch or up a hill.

So why no tire chains for you snow country drivers?

Before we moved to MT and lived in western CO we had 2wd pickup and suburban and had chains for both. I had given up on buying and maintaining 4wds. We hardly ever used the chains on the suburban but I used them a lot on my pickup when logging. I would just do like the log truck drivers and put the chains on at a nice flat smooth place once you got up to the snow line. Since I had a camper trailer I just left my chains on all week but the truck drivers put chains on/off every trip. Those twin screws with the trailers loaded up and chains on would go almost anywhere.

I do have to laugh at people nowadays. Back when I started driving there were very few 4wd, no AWD, and virtually everything was RWD. In CO most people had an extra wheel or two and had snow tires for the rear. These were all bias ply tires of course but most everyone got around just fine. The problem came when it was 70 degrees one day and snowing the next and you hadn't put your snow tires on yet. If it was a really bad storm then everyone just stayed home and there were the few 4wd owners who would volunteer to taxi essential workers like doctors and nurses to their jobs.

I can remember when there was a big snow and the streets were empty and driving my new 4wd pickup through two or three foot deep drifts And that was just on 750-16 bias ply highway tires. When I finally got something with radials on it I thought why would anyone ever need snow tires or even 4wd?

These days "we" have radials, all seasons, all terrains, special winter tires, and All Wheel Drive just to get to the grocery store for a loaf of bread, yet it seems like everyone is stuck or in the ditch all the time. And then they all argue about which AWD is the only one to have ….

The last 16+ years we have lived way out in the hills and a 4wd is almost essential here except for a couple months of the year, not so much because of snow but because of mud. Our "go to" vehicle in the winter is an old Jeep Cherokee with just all season tires all around. It goes through everything without hardly noticing it, from a couple inches of snow up to drift two feet deep. But I know how to drive; I don't just floor it to take off and expect some damn computer to keep the wheels from spinning.

PS: oh yeah the jeep has a full time setting and we just leave it there all the time so it is essentially AWD: no fancy stuff just three open differentials. It also has 2wd, regular 4wd-hi, and 4wd-lo. I do get spoiled with it because you can just drive and not think much about traction. On anything resembling a normal road, the stock suspension has enough flex to keep the weight balanced on all four wheels.

[davischevy]

Everybody here owns 4WD's, nobody has chains. I have a rough old 94 K20 I drive in inclement weather.

It doesn't snow here that often these days, but we do get an occasional ice storm.

People here are just like every where else, either capable, cautious or crazy. I don't mind driving on ice and snow but the other participants make me really uncomfortable.

[Boog]

I don't worry about you and me driving on ice and snow. It's all those other drivers out there that don't know they don't belong out there that concern me.

[Nut Case]

Durning the 70's/80' I drove to Snowbird Ut daily to work the winter season, one Christmas we took the family, and drove to San Diego to go to sea world. My daily driver was a 1/2 chevy 4 X 4, with BF Goodrich All Terrain's on all four wheels not once did I need chains in Little Cottonwood Canyon in all the years I worked at Snowbird (11 seasons) we put on the camper, kids in back and headed for So Cal. We got stopped at El Ca-hone at mid night for the chain law. Had to go back to Victorville to buy tire chains. Paid 2 X the going rate for the same set of chains in Utah. Drove to the chain up area, and chained up my front axle and put the tk in 4 wheel hi proceeded to the check point. The State Patrol Officer told that the chains had to go on the REAR on pick ups no matter that they were four wheel drive or not. I tried explain the it would be safer to stop and steer in 4 wheel drive than to have only traction to the rear. I tried to tell him of my steep uphill and steep down hill experience. Nope chains go on the back. Ca-hone was light snow pack, so back to the chain up area and re-chained my tk. Made it through the check point got down the road around the corner un-chained and survived. Go figure. Here in the Rockies we don't have to deal with freezing rain. Just snow packed pavement.

Several times stuck in traffic going to Snowbird avalanches blocked the road, we'd see Calf. drivers stop and chain up Honda Accords and other front wheel drive cars chain up the rear and wonder why they couldn't move. I wonder.

Just my .02 cents, and that's all I have to say about that.

Nutz