07-25-2020, 04:37 PM | #1 |
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Stroker or Roller?
Starting to build a fresh motor for the Lil' '68, and have acquired a 4 bolt 350 out of a 79 k10
1.94" heads The blocks should make .040 over Looks like the crank should make .010-.010 The block will be decked for optimal quench. This motor will have king bearings, brass freeze plugs, high flow/low pressure oil pump, premium gaskets, double roller timing set, probably hyper-eutectic slugs, reconditioned rods, decent compression (9.75:1 ish), probably top it off with a well tuned Q-Jet There is a little left over in the budget. enough to get a Stroker kit ----> or a roller cam.Not both SO... Stroker vs Roller? I'm leaning toward roller, but never used a roller cam retrofit kit. Anything I should know? Would I be better off building a 383? I have built 383's before and been very pleased. What's not to like? The improved profile of a roller cam might make a sweet running 350 that would be plenty for my little C10. Fear of the unknown, however, is preventing me from pulling the trigger on a $500+ camshaft/lifter set. I know what I'll get with a flat tappet 383 Ain't sure how that compares to a roller cam 350. Don't give a $#!t about performance @ 5500 rip'ems, I don't drive around at red line, I am WAY more concerned about usable torque curve in the 1800 to 4500 rpm range Long winded? sorry Let me know what you think. -Russ Last edited by Greasey Harley; 07-25-2020 at 04:47 PM. |
07-25-2020, 04:47 PM | #2 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
More cubes = more torque. There are many 383 stroker kits available out there at many different price levels. I'd go roller only because of the no zinc oil available today.
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07-25-2020, 06:00 PM | #3 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
I have plenty of non roller cam motors still running. I think that the oil concern is over blown. That said before spending money on machine work check the SCAT catalog. You may get an entire 9000 series kit cheaper than you think.
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07-25-2020, 06:51 PM | #4 | ||
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Quote:
Quote:
Been running Rotella 10w30 in my flat tappet engines for years without issue. I've used Lucas break-in oil to break in dozens of V8's, again, without issue. I know what to expect from a hydraulic flat tappet cam, in a small block Chevy. Just thinking about roller cams and steeper ramps and rounder lobes and whatnot. ...just just thinking -R |
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07-25-2020, 07:25 PM | #5 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
why not use a roller motor to save money on retro fit roller cam . then smack in a cam and stroke it . also get a 1 piece rear main to boot .
ya 383 is nice but full roller just runs so nice and free's up power a little bit . its all in what you like to pick in the end .
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77-k30lb BIG truck build . 87-k30lb budget beater build . 85-k30lb the plow machine build . 85-c10sb summer fun toy . ----------------------------- HOLLEY SNIPER efi = worst case of p.i.t.a i ever had . EDELBROCK pro flo 4 = best deal going so far . love my setup works great. |
07-25-2020, 10:17 PM | #6 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
.
Go roller. Since you've already got the parts for the build and retrofit is necessary, choose a good lifter ( not COMP, but maybe Howards ) and go for it. No more zinc needed in the oil or cam break in required! -klb
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67 C10 fleet fuel injected '70 402, 700r4, 3.73 posi 07 335 sport turbo 6sp 94 Trans Am GT LT1 6sp posi -- sold after 22yrs 99 540 sport V8 6sp -- sold 73 240z L24 4sp -- given to friend 68 C10 step 350/350 3.73 open -- sold |
07-25-2020, 10:40 PM | #7 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
hay weq92f why not comp and specifics ?
reason i ask is i have a full kit new in the box from mid 2010's for a build i have been slowly doing up .
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77-k30lb BIG truck build . 87-k30lb budget beater build . 85-k30lb the plow machine build . 85-c10sb summer fun toy . ----------------------------- HOLLEY SNIPER efi = worst case of p.i.t.a i ever had . EDELBROCK pro flo 4 = best deal going so far . love my setup works great. |
07-25-2020, 11:18 PM | #8 | |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Quote:
I can't confirm whether the quality issue is confined to the big block only or continues to other products, including the small block. Note that I did not find any report of lifter failure, just noise. EDIT: I'm still running the COMP roller lifters, have 3000+ miles on them. The noise hasn't changed much at all. Hth, -klb
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67 C10 fleet fuel injected '70 402, 700r4, 3.73 posi 07 335 sport turbo 6sp 94 Trans Am GT LT1 6sp posi -- sold after 22yrs 99 540 sport V8 6sp -- sold 73 240z L24 4sp -- given to friend 68 C10 step 350/350 3.73 open -- sold Last edited by weq92f; 07-25-2020 at 11:24 PM. |
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07-25-2020, 11:19 PM | #9 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
I say roller cam
i got my newest roller can 350 from a 99 service van Roller cam vortec 350 low milage 110 mi on it needs typical intake gaskets I have not used retro roller kit only roller ready blocks |
07-26-2020, 12:32 AM | #10 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
You guys are all about roller cams. They are an improvement over old tech but what are you gaining over a flat tappet cam that the OP stated he didn't care about max RPM. This is a truck motor that won't have super radical ramps or intensity. There is nothing to a 4500 max RPM motor that a roller is going to bring to the table over 33 cubic inches. For what he wants either will make 20 inches of vacuum and idle smooth as silk. Neither will beat up valve springs. Are you guys that afraid of the newer oil? If that is it when was the last cam you lost? I know that oil isn't what it used to but I am more worried about the crap gas we get now then flat tappets in a 9:1 motor. I run a solid lifter circle track cam in my truck and haven't pulled a valve cover to adjust them in 3 years. Delvac has done just fine lubing it for the engines life. Now if we were talking above 300HP I can see stepping it up when the OP would be taking advantage of the roller properties such as improving the amount of time for valve duration while reducing overlap and increased valve lift but those don't factor into this build or justify purchasing another block and flywheel. Heck i would put the money toward better heads than 76cc chambers and bump the compression while using a $100 cam. Please don't take this as argumentative but as a total disagreement on ways to spend money on the OPs build since he stipulated budget.
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07-26-2020, 08:21 AM | #11 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Going stroker is cheap nowadays. Pistons don't cost much if anymore than a stock piston, and the crank the same. Don't need forged anything for street use. I've built a lot of motors over the years, some for drag racing, not 1 had steel crank or pistons. I never built a 383, but 400s, and the torque is awesome. Torque moves you, horsepower keeps you going. But it's the torque off the line that your gonna feel. I really don't see how you couldn't do both with what little difference between stock n stroker. It will cost more to go roller, but IMO be worth it. Maybe sell the 4 bolt block and grab a newer Vortec block, get roller and better flowing heads. Stroke that and have a healthy motor....
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07-26-2020, 09:16 AM | #12 | |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Quote:
Also you have to factor in you gear ratio, tranamission, and goals. Plus if your willing to add a roller cam later when more funds are available. Especially when the wife is not looking. If you want to go with a flat tappet cam. Besure you buy the correct oil. Zinc was removed for catalytic convertor protection. It is the reason flat tappets last. Every engine i pulled apart recently has had tappet cupping. It used to 20 years ago a slight dip was normal. Now it is almost a full 1/8 dip in some higher mileage engines.0 Some recommend Valvoline ZR1 oil, zinc additives, break in oil, and or Amsoil. I am not up on my oils to give any recommendations now. |
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07-26-2020, 10:25 AM | #13 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
On a small block application, the stroker is a no-brainer IMO. You can get a complete Eagle internally balanced kit for $825 from Competition Products. A reciprocating assembly is a difficult upgrade compared to a cam swap. Do the Stroker kit now. If you want and can afford the roller cam down the line, do that then in the vehicle without needing to get a machine shop involved a second time.
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07-26-2020, 12:33 PM | #14 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Roller cams open and close faster than flat tappet cams - that creates more torque down low. I'm not saying he should necessarily choose a roller over a stroker, but high RPM isn't the only reason for a roller cam. That's why GM put them in Vortec motors, which were only put in trucks.
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07-26-2020, 02:03 PM | #15 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Truckster. We are totally on the same page as to the benefits of a roller. Lightning fast ramp speeds allowing for less overlap and more duration for a comparable grind along with the valve hanging out at max lift longer but that is only if built that way when grinding.
Most grinds are not setup this way but do take some advantage of those characteristics. I have a feeling that the vortec got a roller for emmisions and MPG standards to bring the average up for corporate. Back then the government was talking about adding trucks to the CAFE standards. I could be wrong but I don't think that vortec motors had an overly aggressive ramp and I know lift wasn't crazy. |
07-27-2020, 01:19 PM | #16 |
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Re: Stroker or Roller?
Too bad you didn't get a cheap vortec core motor to build then its a cheap roller cam vs $$$ retrofit and you could have had both roller and stroker.
The oem 79 heads don't flow for crap to begin with. Adding a stroker is just gonna make it more winded. I'd go roller cam for the efficiency.
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