The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network







Register or Log In To remove these advertisements.

Go Back   The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network > 47 - Current classic GM Trucks > The pre 1947 Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board > Projects and Builds

Web 67-72chevytrucks.com


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-29-2018, 03:04 PM   #451
paintman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: washington NJ
Posts: 705
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

[QUOTE=dillonv2008;8172896]what thickness did you use for your plate on floorpan where column and brake pedal are at. and also for your brake assemebly that you mounted to the frame what thickness did you use. it almost looks like 3/16 for frame and 1/8 for floor pan??[/QUOTE

I had originally bought one of those pre made floor pans for a 46 from sheet metal direct, (i think) but it was a piece of $%&t just like all repo parts. So if I remember correctly I used 1/8th for the top of the floor pan. 1/16th felt way to flimsy. But it would have work well with beads rolled into it. But all I had was caveman tools, so 1/8" is was. Can't really remember because that was almost 6 years ago.
paintman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2018, 06:04 PM   #452
dillonv2008
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: sacramento,ca
Posts: 77
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

[quote=paintman;8173252]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dillonv2008 View Post
what thickness did you use for your plate on floorpan where column and brake pedal are at. and also for your brake assemebly that you mounted to the frame what thickness did you use. it almost looks like 3/16 for frame and 1/8 for floor pan??[/QUOTE

I had originally bought one of those pre made floor pans for a 46 from sheet metal direct, (i think) but it was a piece of $%&t just like all repo parts. So if I remember correctly I used 1/8th for the top of the floor pan. 1/16th felt way to flimsy. But it would have work well with beads rolled into it. But all I had was caveman tools, so 1/8" is was. Can't really remember because that was almost 6 years ago.

gotcha gotcha looks awesome been studying the floor and seat and brake to make my own haha
dillonv2008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2018, 07:20 AM   #453
LT7A
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 768
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Nice work Paintman! I like how as time went on you spoke less about your perceived limitations and were more matter of fact about what needed to be done and just did it! You can approach this next one with the confidence of experience now. The truck is beautiful. Did you decide about wheels and tires? Could just paint the ones you have to match each other and call it good for the time being. I think it'd be great if you just continued on in this same thread with the work you're going to do on that Dodge. If not, put it in alternate tinkerings and let us know the link. Since you're going to leave the patina on that one, do you think you might do more of a refurbishment than a full-on custom this next time? Thanks for sharing.
LT7A is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2018, 09:14 AM   #454
paintman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: washington NJ
Posts: 705
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Quote:
Originally Posted by LT7A View Post
Did you decide about wheels and tires? Could just paint the ones you have to match each other and call it good for the time being. I think it'd be great if you just continued on in this same thread with the work you're going to do on that Dodge. If not, put it in alternate tinkerings and let us know the link. Since you're going to leave the patina on that one, do you think you might do more of a refurbishment than a full-on custom this next time? Thanks for sharing.
Funny you should ask! First Wheel Vintiques jerked me around for about 6 weeks. Then I finally got my wheels back from powder coat. Fronts are 15x6 Rears are 15x7. Going to go with wide whites when i finally get off my ass and feel like handing over $1,000!
Just your standard smoothies painted satin black


As far as the Dodge since I couldn't find a decent Mopar forum, I decided to put the build on this forum Alternate Tinkerings until further notice.
Follow the bouncing ball and enjoy.............................
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...50#post8275250
paintman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2018, 11:48 AM   #455
joedoh
Senior Member
 
joedoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Doodah Kansas
Posts: 4,654
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

I know this doesnt help now, but jegs stocks the smoothies and ships the same day. did you order a special offset?
__________________
the mass of men live lives of quiet desperation

Project: WAMEGO
my LU3 4.3 4L60E S10 49 GMC 150
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=765957


if there is a problem, I can have it.
joedoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2018, 02:23 PM   #456
paintman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: washington NJ
Posts: 705
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Quote:
Originally Posted by joedoh View Post
I know this doesnt help now, but jegs stocks the smoothies and ships the same day. did you order a special offset?
Hey Joe! Yes the rears I had custom made with a 4 3/4 offset to tuck the wheels in a little further. That was the easy part. When I went and ordered the fronts (standard size), via their website it took 4 weeks before someone called and confirmed the order. Then, he never forwarded the order to the next in command so apparently my order just sat on his desk. So after a phone call, and a dose of the Paintman's attidude, I had them in 3 days. I knew I could have called Jegs but I figured they would just call Vintiques and have them sent.
paintman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2018, 08:45 PM   #457
docrock
Registered User
 
docrock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Encinitas, CA
Posts: 403
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Name:  20180530_191129.jpg
Views: 194
Size:  38.4 KB

I did the same thing. But, I was at Goodguys and performance was having a sale on US Wheels Smoothies. 50 each. I got 15x6 and 15x7 painted them. Got a guy to mount my L78-15 for 40 out the door. Granted they are 30 year old tires but they hold air and for now they are great for cruising. I did bite the bullet and get the trim rings and caps. Those are not cheap
__________________
1954 GMC on 93 Silverado chassis http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=408344

1942 Chevy 1/2 ton Pickup http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=429494

R.I.P. TOMSPROJECTS 68 FOUR DOOR
docrock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2018, 06:09 PM   #458
paintman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: washington NJ
Posts: 705
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Finally got off my ass and got my tires and caps. I think we will call it finished for now. Over the winter I might put the regular MII spindles back on to see how it sits. Right now it's on 2" dropped.

Rears 235/70 R15 on 7" rims
Fronts 215/70 R15 on 6" rims




paintman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2018, 08:14 PM   #459
joedoh
Senior Member
 
joedoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Doodah Kansas
Posts: 4,654
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

lower the back 2"! the front looks amazing
__________________
the mass of men live lives of quiet desperation

Project: WAMEGO
my LU3 4.3 4L60E S10 49 GMC 150
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=765957


if there is a problem, I can have it.
joedoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2018, 05:52 PM   #460
paintman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: washington NJ
Posts: 705
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Well I'm back with a ****ty update. I have had to take the truck off the road to try and resolve my brake issues. Drove the ole girl around for part of the summer but the pedal is just not comfortable. If you remember I never got a good pedal after bleeding, and it got worse after starting the engine. I just can't drive it this way. I actually bought a whole new booster and MC thinking that was my problem but..........NOPE!

I have literally pumped 3 gallons of brake fluid through the system and just can't get a firm pedal. I have taken care of a few minor leaks but that did not seem to help. Yesterday I spent another 2 hours bleeding each wheel but still no pedal. I even went through the trouble of removing the MC and bench bled it another time. Of course there was no air present in the MC

So I am thinking the actual plumbing may be the culprit.......

Is it ok to mount the prop valve in this position? Or is it possible I have air trapped up at the top by the pressure switch for the brakes?


Next I am thinking perhaps I should have run my rear brake lines the traditional way with one line running across the rear. Instead I have them split with one line running to each drum through a thru frame fitting. Is it perhaps I am trying to move to much fluid through these lines?

And a second question........If this plumbingis in fact ok do I need to run a rear residual valve since my lines come thru the frame above the wheel cylinders? I wouldn't think the fluid would be able to run up hill.

paintman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 09:50 AM   #461
CURSED GEARS
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Lafayette In.
Posts: 248
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

I not a mechanic, but when I was researching my brake system I believe I read that you needed a residual valve if your lines and plumbing was above your master cylinder.
I had the same problems with my brakes for some time when I built my truck. I bled mine countless times and eventually got it where it would stop. I still think it could be better, but not sure how to improve it. I got drums on all four wheels with a firewall mounted MC. Good luck and lets us know how you resolve it.
CURSED GEARS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 10:00 AM   #462
CURSED GEARS
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Lafayette In.
Posts: 248
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

One other thing, With your rear lines running up hill, It would seem like the fluid would drain back towards your master cylinder causing you to possibly have to refill the lines each time you pump your brakes. Again, I'm not a mechanic, just a hobbyist like you. I could be full of it.
CURSED GEARS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2018, 11:18 AM   #463
1project2many
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Lakes Region NH
Posts: 2,209
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

I'm here because you asked for folks in the 47-59 forum to look at pictures of brake lines.


Looks like a nice build but yikes! 19 pages to hunt through? Can ya shortcut the search and link to the pictures?

Edit... Nevermind. Looks like filters on the work PC were blocking the photos. I figured out a solution.

Also, is there a single post that lays out what hardware you're running?

It sounds like you're fighting two problems. One is that the pedal doesn't feel right, the other is that the truck doesn't stop fast enough. Is that right?

I think I saw a post that said you'd driven the truck with the vacuum line disconnected. I realize that you need legs like piledrivers to stop when the vacuum is unhooked, but is the pedal nice and high when you do this? That can be a big clue about whether or not you have a problem in the hydraulic system or a problem with the booster. Also, simple question, have you ever tried to see if all four tires stop when the brakes applied? Jack up the wheels, wedge a stick between brake pedal and seat, then try to spin the tires. Or just lock 'em up on a dirt road and look for skidmarks.

Another easy test is to plug the front brakes off at the master and see how the pedal feel changes, then switch out your plug so the rear brakes are disconnected. Since it takes pressure in both front and rear chambers of the master before you feel pressure at the pedal, this helps tell you which half of the truck is acting up. I've even plugged both ports to confirm the booster was junk (you should feel a good pedal almost instantly with both ports plugged). Easy to make a temporary plug, just take a short piece of flared tubing with a nut and fold the end opposite the flare two or three times then squeeze it in a vise or hammer it flat.

Last edited by 1project2many; 11-11-2018 at 11:38 AM.
1project2many is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2018, 10:02 AM   #464
CSHADES
Registered User
 
CSHADES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: portage wi
Posts: 372
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

The set up you have is going to need some residual valves, 10 lbs rear and 2 lbs for the front. They should be mounted as close to the mc as possible. I have run into this bleeding problem before, I have friend with a 35 ford coupe that we needed to bleed the brakes after some work was done. We pumped about 3 gallons through and the pedal still was really low, I ended up using a pressure power bleeder to push all the air out of the system. That was no easy task because we had to pull the front seat and carpet out to access the top of the master with the bleeder top.
CSHADES is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2018, 09:11 PM   #465
paintman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: washington NJ
Posts: 705
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

Ok just so were all clear as to what is going on, a little review. When I first got the brakes bled, I would say I had about an 85% good pedal with the engine off. I had a good 85% pedal from the top all the way to the bottom (full travel of pedal).

As soon as I turned the engine on, I lost ALL pedal for the first 3" of travel, and then got a good 85% pedal. I was able to drive the truck and it stopped good. It was just not comfortable not having that first 3" of feeling in the pedal. Obviously something was wrong.

It is my understanding that with a power booster as with all my other daily drivers, you should have a rock solid pedal when engine is off and you should barely be able to move it.

I tried disconnecting the booster and driving the truck, but the truck would not stop at all even though I had that 85% pedal. So for the time being I ruled out the booster as being the problem,

Now that I have pulled the truck off the road, I have found a couple leaks at the banjo fittings (worse design in the history of automotive engineering), and fixed them. I am just re-thinking my entire plumbing design and figured since the truck is up off the floor I would re-do some things.

First off I have purchased a complete new booster/MC disc/drum with a 1" bore. But now I am thinking that perhaps the running of 2 seperate lines to the drums could be my problem.

Also I have been reading that alot of people have trouble bleeding brakes with the thru frame fittings. It seems plausible to me. If you look at a thru frame fitting they basicall go from a 3/16 hole on one side to a nearly 1/2" hole all the way to the other side, and then back down to 3/16. I'm no fluid dynamics or hydraulic specialist but it seems to me it would be very hard for the MC to push the fluid in that area. I have found that Art Morrison makes a different style thru frame fitting that supposedly eliminates bleeding problems. Hmmmmm?

Also just to be clear, and as the photos clearly show, I do have residual valves in both the front and rear circuits. And yes I do have the right PSI and they are pointed in the proper direction. And, for now, I have them both mounted within 2" of the MC. I have however been reading that some guys run the rear residual valve after the proportioning valve. What difference this would make, I have know idea.

AND YES I HAVE BENCH BLED THE MC, SO MUCH SO THAT MY ARMS HURT!!!!!

AND YES I DID CHECK THE BOOSTER PIN TO MC BORE CLEARANCE. HELL I EVEN SPENT THE $35 AND BOUGHT THE TRICK LITTLE TOOL.

So thats where I am at. I'm not sure if I should try different thru frame fittings or just bite the bullet and run my rear lines the traditional way with one line feeding a "T" mounted on the rear running to both wheel cylinders.
paintman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2018, 02:45 PM   #466
CSHADES
Registered User
 
CSHADES's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: portage wi
Posts: 372
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

I see the valves now, You are good there. I still suggest you find a pressure power bleeder, the car I talked about before really was kicking my butt until I put the pressure bleeder on it and pushed all of the air out. The 2 lines to the rear should make no difference in pedal feel if you have enough volume of fluid which I think you do. I have had some issues with the adjustable prop valves but that was more of a balance problem than a pedal movement.
CSHADES is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2018, 08:57 AM   #467
solidaxel
Registered User
 
solidaxel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Cactus Patch So. Az
Posts: 4,649
Re: 46 pickemup in NJ "the Rebuild"

I am convinced that 46 Chevy brakes are "possed"

I had the most trouble with the one I built
Three M/C later and two boosters later it now feels like it will slide the tires and I can feel the power master.
I am almost sure the fix was a 15/16" master #3
I did change the Welwood pads to a much softer compound, and they are very "dirty"
I did read somewhere where the larger thru the frame fittings were a problem and as I remember I think the fix was to place a "filler wire" in the cavity of the frame part of the fitting to reduce the volume..............old age has set in!
Your idea sounds like it should work.
Have you tried to isolate the front from the rear
Get 1/2 working at a time?
__________________
53 TuTone Extended Cab 350 4-Spd 3:08 (SOLD)
53 Chevy Moldy pearl green ZZ-4 4L60E 9" 3:25
55 GMC 1st Black Mll ZZ4 TKO 600 5 sp 3:73
62 Solidaxle Corvette Roman Red 327
340hp 4spd 3:36
65 Corvette Coupe 327 350hp 4spd 4:11
78 Black Silverado SWB (350/350) 5.3 & 4L60E 3:42
2000 S-Type 3.0 (wifes cruiser)
2003 GMC SCSB 5.3 4L60E 3:42
solidaxel is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright 1997-2013 67-72chevytrucks.com