K-10 Closed Knuckle Needs Repair

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

Had the ole girl in for a new muffler yesterday. The drivers side tire is wearing on the inside. Looks like she needs some parts for the closed knuckle front end. Looking for suggestions on where to locate parts, tips and procedures (i.e. a write up with photos) on how to replace/repair this problem.

Looking at my 1968 Chevrolet Truck Chassis Service Manual Series 10-60 it has a procedure description but nothing for photos or much detail. Is this a pretty straight forward procedure to replace the bearings and cups on the top and bottom of the closed knuckle?

Thanks
TGPB

[N2TRUX]

Welcome to the forum The Grand Pooh-Bah. I am moving this to the 4x4 forum. Most of the 4wd guys hang out there and should be able to help you .

[odog]

Welcome from southern Idaho. In my opinion, I would change out the closed knuckle axle for an open knuckle design. Dana 44's are cheap and easy to find, and they are decent as far as toughness, and turning radius would increase. Like I said, just my opinion.

[dbash]

Originally Posted by odog

Welcome from southern Idaho. In my opinion, I would change out the closed knuckle axle for an open knuckle design. Dana 44's are cheap and easy to find, and they are decent as far as toughness, and turning radius would increase. Like I said, just my opinion.

I agree with this advice that odog has provided 100%

Good Luck to you and welcome.
Posted via Mobile Device

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

What would be a good host for the 68 K-10 that would not require any welding or drive line modifications?

[odog]

I know at least up to 1976 the dana 44 are the same. I am putting a 3/4 ton dana 44 under mine from a 76 scottsdale. They are pretty easy to find and easy to swap. Just roll the old one out and the new one in as long as you find one with the same gear ratio as your rearend. Check craigslist and the local wrecking yards, they should be pretty comon.

[odog]

on craigslist right now in lewiston there is a 72 chevy front and rearend with 3:73 gears fr $300. (208)790-4373

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

Originally Posted by odog

on craigslist right now in lewiston there is a 72 chevy front and rear end with 3:73 gears fr $300.

I'm picking this up next week after he gets them pulled off the truck he is parting out. Thanks for sharing this with me!

[odog]

Hey no problem, Im just glad you could use it. I ocasionally look up there for stuff and just happened on that one.

[j.kirn]

Originally Posted by The Grand Pooh-Bah

I'm picking this up next week after he gets them pulled off the truck he is parting out. Thanks for sharing this with me!

Maybe when you swap that no good closed knuckle axle, you could pass it on to someone who thinks the world of them,or for parts, dont throw it away

[61K10]

somebody that knows could answer his org question. any parts out there? I have a 61 with 3.90 gears. i guess i would need ft and bk axles.

[Redcap]

Originally Posted by 61K10

somebody that knows could answer his org question. any parts out there? I have a 61 with 3.90 gears. i guess i would need ft and bk axles.

There isn't much made for the closed-knuckle. Most people just toss in an open-knuckle and are done with the headache.

[BLAZERMAN]

I agree with everyone else as far as getting rid of the closed knuckle front, you can use any GM front from 71 up to 87 and even up to 91 on Blazers and Suburbans. Just make sure the gear ratio matches what you have now. The 73 and later axles are a little stronger due to a larger axle u-joint and no necking down on the axle shafts. Its hard to believe till youve done the swap just how much better your turning radius is...plus disc brakes.. and you can walk into any parts store on a saturday and they will more than likely have what you need for it.
I know some diehards want to keep their truck as stock as possible though and nothing wrong with that. I've found parts in the past at Quad 4x4 but its been awhile since I've oredered anything from them...I'm sure they still have the wiper seal kits but give them a call on any hard parts. http://quad4x4.com/gm44fHDclosedknuckle1962-1969.html

And this may help you too. [scroll down to page 20]
http://www2.dana.com/pdf/5310-3.pdf

[BLAZERMAN]

Originally Posted by 61K10

somebody that knows could answer his org question. any parts out there? I have a 61 with 3.90 gears. i guess i would need ft and bk axles.

Yep thats a ratio your probably not gonna find in the later axles..lots of 3.73s out there in the 1/2 tons tho..or 4.10 in the 3/4 tons, either would be pretty close for ya.

[maxwoof]

I like the closed knuckle because it is original. That's my thing. I can't say that it is any better than the later year open knuckle though. However, I did rebuild the knuckles in my 62 k-20 a few years back. I bought the big felt seals in a kit from quad 4x4, i believe. The knuckle bearings and seals are all available on rockauto.com. I actually got my knuckle bearings from a local guy, but I gave him the numbers from the rockauto website. I would have saved some money if I ordered on line, but I didn't realize I needed them until I got the truck up in the air...

Basically, they are like little wheel bearings you would find in a conventional front end. You need to replace the cups and cones. There is an adjustment by way of adidng shims when you put it back together, but I just put in the same shims I took out. It seems to be fine.

Also, instead of relying on oil in the knuckle, I packed all the bearings with grease, like conventional wheel bearings. This includes the knuckle bearings. Didn't put any gear oil in the knukles, just painted some on the felt seals. No drips! I did this in 2009, and seems to be working fine. Granted, the truck is not a daily driver, but a few times a year it sees the highway for 2-3 hours at a time, and local driving on the weekends.

I got a lot of parts for it form rockauto.

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

What were the parts called that you got from Rock Auto to repair the front?

[maxwoof]

Knuckle bearings are found under steering. Mine were shot, you could grab the wheel top to bottom and flop it around. These fixed that right up. Wheel seals/bearings are under brake/wheel/hub. Come to think of it, bad/out of adjustment wheel bearings can cause tire wear too...

[Ridgeback]

The Grand Pooh-Bah

If you post your email I will send you a Dana Spicer 44 Axle manual that may be of some help.

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

you can send it to

stealthzj@yahoo.com

Thanks

[Ridgeback]

The Grand Pooh-Bah

You should have mail.

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

Now that I'm doing the conversion from Closed Knuckle to Open Knuckle is their any wisdom anyone would like to share before I get started? I already have power brakes and power steering.

What other things should I pick up at the auto parts store while I'm in the big city picking up my new project. I also have brake and diff. fluid on hand.

I recall reading somewhere that the springs on the 68 are a different width than 72. The 72 axles that I'm picking up are currently mounted under a 67 K10. Should I purchase the springs also or will my springs work fine? My springs are 3" wide

[odog]

I think they will just mount up. I had 72 axles under a 67 frame at one time and I dont recall changing anything. Take a look at the draglink between the pitman arm and the axle on the 72 set and see if it matches the one on your 68. I think the one on the 67 was different and I had to change that when I swapped to a 72 axle. If I remember correctly the 67 was a solid piece and the 72 was adjustable.

[The Grand Pooh-Bah]

I'm finally getting this project started. Been a busy summer.

The brake lines on the open knuckle were cut and when I checked for new brake lines I noticed they are different threads between the open and closed knuckles. What brake lines should I get to match them up to the threads on the connection at the frame?

[JPBrecheisen]

You can get the bearings (cups and cones) from any local parts store.
Part numbers for the cup/cone trunion bearings are 11590 and 11520. Should run you about $100 bucks for all of them. You will need 4 of each. They are super easy to replace. Only special tools you need is a soft brass drift or a punch and a medium size hammer for taping the races out from the axle housing.

When you replace them, you'll have to re-shim the trunion caps. Shims are available for about $5.00. THe ball seals are also available for $9.00 per side. I have a maintenance book that has the specifications. You'll need a spring scale to set the correct pre-load with the shims. You can get buy without one if you have to.

If you want to change out to a open knuckle axle, move ahead with your project, but if this is your daily driver, you can replace the kingpin bearings no problem in an afternoon. You won't even need that many tools to do the job. Other than some greasy hands, you'd have about 6 hours in the whole thing tops to get it fixed up. Why change a whole axle out for some warn king pin bearings??? JMO.

Look at Walck's 4WD for the knuckle seals and shims. They are available at other places, but the old Willy's Jeeps used the same king pins and seals, and they're super cheap from Walck's. Other places sell them for about 4x the price..no thanks. I'm doing a 1962 GMC K1000 right now and I just got everything I needed for less than 150 bucks.

PM or call if you want. (254-423-7237) I can help you out. Check my thread on the truck I'm working on. There is pictures of the axle I did on my Willys wagon. They're way easy to service and work on. For some reaosn, they've gotten a bad name for no reason what so ever. I say fix the bearings and keep it original. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a closed knuckle axle.

Jonathon

[Redcap]

Originally Posted by JPBrecheisen

You can get the bearings (cups and cones) from any local parts store.
Part numbers for the cup/cone trunion bearings are 11590 and 11520. Should run you about $100 bucks for all of them. You will need 4 of each. They are super easy to replace. Only special tools you need is a soft brass drift or a punch and a medium size hammer for taping the races out from the axle housing.

When you replace them, you'll have to re-shim the trunion caps. Shims are available for about $5.00. THe ball seals are also available for $9.00 per side. I have a maintenance book that has the specifications. You'll need a spring scale to set the correct pre-load with the shims. You can get buy without one if you have to.

If you want to change out to a open knuckle axle, move ahead with your project, but if this is your daily driver, you can replace the kingpin bearings no problem in an afternoon. You won't even need that many tools to do the job. Other than some greasy hands, you'd have about 6 hours in the whole thing tops to get it fixed up. Why change a whole axle out for some warn king pin bearings??? JMO.

Look at Walck's 4WD for the knuckle seals and shims. They are available at other places, but the old Willy's Jeeps used the same king pins and seals, and they're super cheap from Walck's. Other places sell them for about 4x the price..no thanks. I'm doing a 1962 GMC K1000 right now and I just got everything I needed for less than 150 bucks.

PM or call if you want. (254-423-7237) I can help you out. Check my thread on the truck I'm working on. There is pictures of the axle I did on my Willys wagon. They're way easy to service and work on. For some reaosn, they've gotten a bad name for no reason what so ever. I say fix the bearings and keep it original. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a closed knuckle axle.

Jonathon

Other than a significantly worse turning radius and vastly inferior brakes (drum vs disc).