engine dies in 15 minutes

[lyrikz]

Originally Posted by happy1970GMC

So I got my truck home, carb's in pieces in a box. $300, including towing both ways. For all you who make a living at working on cars, it just got a little tougher to prove you are honest. This is a town of about 100,000 people, many mechanics. I'm looking into buying an ad in the local paper to tell people about this. No names of course, the justice system protects the guilty, not the victims. I'd like the honest mechanics to know why people may not trust them.

In Colorado, small claims court doesn't cross county lines, since I moved a few
miles recently, there's no help there. Angie's list says these people are great, who bought them off? Maybe they are doing their own reviews. Since I got into this I've done more research about these people. There are horror stories about the owner, including flipping customers off in his parking lot, on Main street. There will be one less classic truck on the streets for the foreseeable future.

That line alone is so much crap i cant even continue with you. You expect them to pay your tow bill or to diagnose it for free?? Come on man.

[happy1970GMC]

They wanted $150 up front for diagnosing the problem. I agreed to that. They didn't say the carb was the only problem, they said it was the first problem. Then, they said "you can't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet carb. You have to go to fuel injection for $2500, or an Edelbrock or Holly for $600." I found 3 places to buy re-built Quadrajets in 10 minutes, starting at $275.

I understand they were trying to "upsell" me. But I don't believe they don't know re-built Quadrajets are widely available. Summit, Jegs, National Carburetors, Guaranteed Carburetors, just to name a few all stock re-built Quadrajets. There are also many places that work on them.

"You can't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet carb. You have to go with fuel injection or an edelbrock or Holly for $600." They weren't recommending a different carb or system, they were denying that Quadrajets are available.

While waiting for the tow truck, I looked under the hood. When I tried to close it, it wouldn't close. There was a deep well socket and an extension on the drip edge. Of course I considered keeping it, but didn't want to be like them. When I took it to the counter, Nick said, "it must be Eric's". John, another mechanic, took it and said "it's mine now".

I don't expect them to work for free, I expect them to be honest. I agreed to pay them for their time, but they flat out lied to me. I'm sure there are honest mechanics around, I'm also sure there are dishonest mechanics who will try to rip off their customers as much as possible.

[lyrikz]

Originally Posted by happy1970GMC

They wanted $150 up front for diagnosing the problem. I agreed to that. They didn't say the carb was the only problem, they said it was the first problem. Then, they said "you can't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet carb. You have to go to fuel injection for $2500, or an Edelbrock or Holly for $600." I found 3 places to buy re-built Quadrajets in 10 minutes, starting at $275.

I understand they were trying to "upsell" me. But I don't believe they don't know re-built Quadrajets are widely available. Summit, Jegs, National Carburetors, Guaranteed Carburetors, just to name a few all stock re-built Quadrajets. There are also many places that work on them.

"You can't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet carb. You have to go with fuel injection or an edelbrock or Holly for $600." They weren't recommending a different carb or system, they were denying that Quadrajets are available.

While waiting for the tow truck, I looked under the hood. When I tried to close it, it wouldn't close. There was a deep well socket and an extension on the drip edge. Of course I considered keeping it, but didn't want to be like them. When I took it to the counter, Nick said, "it must be Eric's". John, another mechanic, took it and said "it's mine now".

I don't expect them to work for free, I expect them to be honest. I agreed to pay them for their time, but they flat out lied to me. I'm sure there are honest mechanics around, I'm also sure there are dishonest mechanics who will try to rip off their customers as much as possible.

About the quadrajets. I hear about that alot. The reasoning behind that is you could spend 300 bucks and buy a new edelbrock, slap it on, and be driving reliably right away. I have steered customers towards carbs like that in the past. Some guys wont even mess with quads for some reason. Did you mention that you found a quadrajet for 275 and asked if they would install it? Some shops will not install customer supplied parts. I do it, but rarely.

All those places that you named about the quadrajets are online companies. I dont order parts online. None of the shops around me do unless its a special part, but i try my hardest to not do that. Many reasons to that. If the part is wrong or does not work you have to pay to reship it, it takes time, and time is money. They tried to sell you what they had. You really cant blame them to badly for that.

They might be denying quadrajets because they cant get them locally. I had a subaru in here recently with a very similar issue. It was a 1 barrel carb, super rare. I had to order it online. The part was absolute ****. I had to eat the shipping and the time to remove and replace it. The second one i got was actually decent and it fixed the issue.

I have left tools in a car before.. Happens once a month maybe. I still dont see how they lied though. You should of contacted us on here, or spoke with them more. Talk to them about what you found, work with them. Id like to know what they did for $150 dollars. Do you have a work order for what they did. I know if i have a car and i diagnose it and the cust. cant afford to fix it i try to help with diagnostic time. $150 dollars is about 1.5 hours of diag, maybe 2 in some places. Really curious what they checked for that.

[Davidf]

"carb's in pieces in a box" Did you send the truck over like that, or that is how it came back. If the later, I would be very upset.

[lyrikz]

Originally Posted by Davidf

"carb's in pieces in a box" Did you send the truck over like that, or that is how it came back. If the later, I would be very upset.

Well, it would of cost more to reassemble everything. You get that right?
Lady in here today. She authorized an hour to tear apart the front of her car to find a leak. We get it all torn apart and i give her a price for repair. She states she wants her cousins brothers bests friends ex husband to repair the car so she will take it. I explain that the car is apart. It took us an hour to get this far and she can take it while its apart or we can reassemble it for additional labor. She explained she was broke, so i cut her a deal on parts (cost) and labor and she left happy.. Her cousins brothers bests friends ex husband didnt have to repair it.

It sounds like there was just a TON of lack of communication. You had no idea the carb was torn apart? Did they mention that it would be extra to put it back together?

[happy1970GMC]

Thanks for your time guys. Let me try to get to all your points in one reply. I don't have a way to scan this receipt, so I'll type it in.

Labor Description: Analyze and advise: Customer states after about 15 minutes running the vehicle will die. May need to charge the battery. The customer states there is no vacuum in the tank when the vehicle dies.

Results: The technician has removed the carburator to overhaul and found the the internal parts of the carb were worn badly and parts were cracked where it was leaking gas. Also the air/fuel set screw is bent, the venchuries are damaged, and the throttle shaft has some play in it. The recomendation was to replace the unit with a edelbrock unit or install a remanufactured quadrajet. Customer declined further repiars at this time. Customer has replaced the following parts: new coil, new fuel pump, new fuel filter(on dash-not installed. Customer declined further repairs and has elected to tow the vehicle away with the carburator apart.

This is exactly as written, my spell checker is upset, but I don't hire mechanics for their spelling. The cost is listed as 158.66 for labor, the rest for carb rebuild kit, float(nothing wrong with the old brass one), shop supplies. I'm a machinist and I order tools, I know shop supplies aren't free.

I realize to put the carb back together costs money. When I decide to work on it again I'll look real close for any cracks in it, and the other problems listed. I would not expect them to rebuild it for free. I didn't expect them to do anything for free, I agreed to pay for them to find the problem, $150 to start. What would you guys think if someone said "you can't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet"? You may not like Quads, you know more about carbs than I do, but you also know that there are hundreds of thousands of them around, and many people to work on them. I wasn't just steered toward Edlebrock or Holly, I was told "you can't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet." The recommendation about a "remanufactured Quadrajet" didn't come up until they were writing the receipt.

I'm sure you can tell from my posts how little I know about fixing cars. If anyone wants to discuss machining, I'll get an idea of how much you know, and what I can learn from you, too. I also know that anyone can have a bad day, or make a mistake, just ask my boss about mine.

These guys said, "you can't find anyone to work on a Quad carb." I certainly would have respected their opinion had they said "we like edelbrock or holly. I work with a Corvette guy and frequently ask his opinion, he likes Accell, edelbrock, and anything Corvette. They didn't admit I had options other than what they gave me until I asked if they had never heard of Summit, or Guaranteed Carbs, or National Carbs.

I bought this truck knowing that I'd have to work on it, that's part of the experience of having a classic vehicle. There's a big difference between keeping a vehicle going yourself, and just having the money to pay someone else do all the work, though I'd like to try that second option.

I fought with this problem for several weekends, talked to you guys, and anyone else who might know, and had to admit I needed help. I went to a mechanic highly recommended on Angie's list. I agreed to pay them for their time and expertise, just as I expect to get paid for mine. What I got was a hardsell of things I didn't want. I will check the carb out carefully, and get some other guys to look at it and see if they see any problems with it. I readily agreed to take it back in a box because I chose not to trust these guys, based on the fact that they lied about the availability of Quad repairs.

They had to take the carb apart to check it's condition, as far as I know it doesn't hurt to have a carb rebuilt from time to time. I'm not sure that I believe what they said about it, but either way, I can live with that. My truck wasn't running when I took it to them, it's still not running. I don't use it to get to work, just errands and hauling stuff. I spent $50 on towing, ok.

So I spent $300 and I'm right back where I started. I took my vehicle back, unfinished, because they lied to me. They said I couldn't find anyone to work on a Quadrajet carb. If they lied about that, what else were they lying about?

Sorry this is so long and probably poorly written. I'm trying to get the facts to you. Lyrikz, you are welcome to find flaws in my position, I will try to answer any other criticism you have. But they did lie to me when they said there's no one around to work on a Quadrajet carb.

[Grumpy old man]

You may want to consider growing some thicker skin ! This is turning into a poor me thread . You say your a machinist yet your dealing with a VERY SIMPLE PROBLEM You have a fuel flow issue ! This is a simple repair yet you want to chase gremlins ? Pull the fuel sending unit in the tank and clean the filter and be done with it ! Talking about buying ads to enlighten the population or threatening to sue some shop over not performing in the way you see as being correct will have your broke truck sitting in the garage for years . Again . Anytime you disassemble parts (carb) and then blindly expect the mechanic to fix what you tore apart is a futile attempt at auto repair . What exactly do you build as a machinist ?

[jeffahart]

Hi HappyGMC1970,
You need to read Roe and Ruggles, great bedside reading. Learn! It's a great carburetor! The beauty of an old mechanical vehicle is you can never get stranded, you just say... Fuel or Spark.... start at point A move to point x until you find the problem. Stop skipping steps!

Now, go get some bedtime reading material! Mechanics don't work for free, and they don't like working on junk anymore than me!

[happy1970GMC]

Jeffahart I like Quadrajets and I do want to keep it. When it died, I could pull on the throttle and see the gas shoot in. And I never expected any one to work for free.

Grumpy old man I didn't take the carb apart, they did. What part of lying don't you get?

[jeffahart]

[QUOTE=happy1970GMC;7519053]Jeffahart I never expected any one to work for free.
QUOTE]

OK, good to know!

[Grumpy old man]

Here are a few resources: I still think your problem is in the fuel line , Clogged fuel pick up in tank , collapsed rubber fuel line under cab or the inline fuel filter ,also the bronze filter in the carb fuel inlet ? MOST auto mechanics working today don't have a clue as to how these old trucks work and are only accustomed to plugging into an OBD port and letting the computer tell them whats broken . I don't know anything about the current computer driven trucks but I know I could have yours running in less than an hour .Average age of new technicians working today 20-35 didn't start their profession until the year 2000 and these trucks were already 30 something years old . Very possible that they really didn't have a clue of what to do with a Quadrajet .Thats why I suggested finding a local car club to help you .

http://quadrajetparts.com/quadrajet-...-c-128_33.html

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/eng...retor-rebuild/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-q_bk22TQQ

http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/w...4MV_carburetor

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/15800...FQepaQod2DgEkw

http://quadrajetcarburetors.com/bush...tructions.html


http://www.summitracing.com/search/p...et-carburetors

[happy1970GMC]

Thanks Grumpy, I didn't want to do it yet, but I'm going to go through the fuel system from tank to carb. Just need to figure out if I want to rebuild my carb, or get a re-built one.

[swamp rat]

Originally Posted by happy1970GMC

Thanks Grumpy, I didn't want to do it yet, but I'm going to go through the fuel system from tank to carb. Just need to figure out if I want to rebuild my carb, or get a re-built one.

I agree with Grumpys last post 100% on all accounts. Especially the part about today's technician not knowing how to troubleshoot a carb related issue, maybe better off finding a performance shop for carb related trouble shooting.

I would also consider sending your carb out for a total rebuild so they can bush the shafts or resurface of warped body, or whatever it may need if you are not well versed at rebuilding the carb yourself.. I have not needed these services myself but a good one will be sure to ask if your engine is stock, size ect so they can set it up properly.

Cant help but wonder if the mechanic's have lost a spring or check ball or other parts somewhere along the line.

http://www.quadrajetcarburetors.com/
http://www.thecarbshop.com/
http://www.carburetorusa.com/
http://www.sparkyscarbs.com/

[zeldman]

If you haven't already done it, replace ALL the rubber fuel lines. One teeny tiny crack will suck air and not gas, then the engine will not run.

As mentioned before, won't hurt to take out the tank and clean it, then replace the pickup tube sock.

Q-Jets are still great carburetors. Finding someone to work on them can be hard, but they are out there. I know several people that can do it, and I am the youngest of those I know at 56. But none of these folks work as a mechanic anymore.

[swamp rat]

I just read the other 3 threads too:

Did the dieing problem start after the Pertronic's instal? is so i would have another look at the electrical side but that would be after the carb issue is fixed and the engine dies again. As has been said you need to verify spark and fuel once it dies.

Your missing the bi metatalic choke spring and linkage, i would try to rectify the stock choke setup in the process of getting the carb rebuilt, i just saw a spring a little while back on the parts for sale board..

[happy1970GMC]

Thanks Swamp rat and Zeldman, I think you are right about letting an experienced person rebuild the carb. I put in the Pertronic 3 years ago. I verified the spark when I last had it running. When it died, I could get under the hood and pull on the throttle cable and gas would shoot into the carb. Anyway, I'll get a re-built Quadrajet, and go through the fuel system and see where that get me, as always, thanks for your help.

[happy1970GMC]

To anyone following this: A competent mechanic found a wire from the ignition switch was faulty in a couple places. It doesn't run great yet, but at least it runs.