53 3600 s10 chassis good idea or bad ?

[1953]

Im seriously considering doing the s10 swap. I have a 53 3600 and im told thay the cab and front clip is all the same as a 3100, the bed i would shorten if i have to and modify the fenders and what not, but what if i used a extended cab s10 could i keep the 3600 body exactly the same ? Anyways let me hear some ideas bros im litterally ready to do this i am going to purchase the s10 chassis mounting kit from code 504 so yeah what s10 chassis would better suit me for this project, also i will be putting a small block 350 in that ive already had bored and rebuilt. Thanks guys hope to hear some good info!

[Henry50]

The 3600 has the same dog house as the 3100.
Personally I hate the idea of a frame swap. I would shorten the existing frame and go with a dropped 1/2 ton axle with disc brakes, or a mustang II kit if I wanted independent suspension.

[1953]

U know i talked to a couple fellas and they said they wouldnt recomend that smh idk why maybe its a matyer of opinion and all but i honestly want that lol

[mongocanfly]

If your wanting to know if the x-cab wheelbase matches your 3600 truck that's as easy as pulling a tape measure on whatever donor truck you have..the cabs are all the same on 3100 3600 3800..

[mongocanfly]

A little research turns up this..
The x-cab shortbed s10 has a wheelbase of 122.9 in
The 3600 ad has a wheelbase of 125.29 in

[joedoh]

what is your...

1. space? Do you have room to have one or two or even three trucks completely taken apart and still have room to work? garage or driveway?

2. tools? Do you have a welder? a torch? a grinder?

3. skill? have you ever welded? wired a vehicle from scratch? replaced every part of every system on a vehicle?

4. punchlist? LS/LQ/LM swap? Air conditioning? Interior? see #3, can you do all of this yourself (no lying, if you havent done it and you think you can that can be the kind of hubris that makes a lot of these projects get sold on craigslist as a pile of parts)

5. timeframe? drive in a year? two years? next month?

6. budget? this is a big one. take a piece of paper and write down everything you think you will buy, then write down what you think it will cost. add it up. double it. double it again. do you have that much?


mounting the body is literally the easiest part of the job, especially with a premade kit. do you have the rest of the skill and space and budget to finish after that? check out the s10 swap sticky http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=632686 skymangs goes into great detail about the s10 swap particulars.

if you choose to do a MII remember you will still address all the same projects as an s10 swap, harness, drivetrain, brakes, radiator, pedals, gauges, literally everything else EXCEPT mounting the body which I said is literally the easiest part.

I did a 3600 on s10 and will do another, I found a shortbed to use.

[MARTINSR]

JoeDoh laid out a great way to look at it! I can't agree with the MII needed all the same stuff as the S10 swap I can't imagine in a million years there is any similarities at all! You could put that motor and trans in a stock truck and not even need to do a single thing relating to pedals and gauges and harness, rad yeah, in the stock rad support, they aren't even close, not even in the same planet in related work. You COULD do all those things but they aren't absolutely necessary.

But before you even think about details, I would like to go down a completely different path, what are your expectations and needs?

1. How will the truck be driven?

Weekend cruiser to the old burger joint in town for the show on friday night? With twice a year a few hundred miles to a Goodguys event and 40 miles twice a year to your brothers house?
Needing to update the frame is nuts, a total waste of time. Drive it and enjoy it.

You plan on replacing your late model truck towing a speed boat once a month 100 miles to the lake. Commuting every day all over the area through winding roads while drinking a cup of coffee and checking your cell phone for customer messages?

The frame swap may be for you.

2. Have you driven a nicely built stock chassis truck? If you haven't, how do you know you "need" to change what you have?

A well set up truck is pretty amazing, I know I was shocked when I drove a friends truck after I had done a Camaro clip on my truck. Now mind you, I had never driven my Camaro clipped truck. And it had been years since I drove it with the stock suspension. Had driven it thousands of miles towed trailers, drag raced it, but it had been years. I thought I HAD to have that Camaro clip so I did it. But after driving my friends with a dropped axle and set up right, damn, holy crap I was blown away at how nice it drove. I immediately made plans to sell the Camaro clip frame and put a stock one with a dropped axle. They really do drive nice if you have it set up right.

But it goes back to my 1. question, what are your expectations? A MustangII style front end is a MUCH smaller project that you can be on the road in no time driving a cool old truck. Not a 90's S-10 with a nice paint job.

Brian

DISCLAIMER: I can't make it clear enough, I am not knocking people who do the S-10 swap. As my 1. question makes all the difference in the world. My main point is it seems as though people jump into the S-10 swap thinking it's a MUST. Well it's not, not by a long shot. 50 years ago people were driving these trucks on the same highways towing boats and doing everything we do today in a new Silverado, they did it with drum brakes and a single reservore master cyl (oh the horrors). All I am trying to point out is to look deeper into WHY you would think about it. If it's for you, cool, but if it's not, rock on with your stock frame.

[whitedog76]

I've never been a fan of the S10 swap. The 3600 trucks have a 3/16 frame, which in my opinion is heavier duty than any S10 chassis.

Not to mention, most S10 frame swaps require raising the bed floor or lowering your rear fenders, depending on the install.

From a fabrication standpoint, there's probably less work involved, just doing a IFS swap and installing a late model rearend. Plus all your body mounts, etc... are in the correct place.

If you really want to do a frame swap, I'm going to suggest looking at a 98 or newer Ranger. The longbed Ranger has a 117 wheelbase and the super cab is 125.9, which is just about perfect for centering your wheels in the fenders. You can also upgrade to 13" brakes from a Sport-Trac.

[Mains52]

I'm doing one on a 52 3600 right now. I got a short bed S10 frame for free and my original frame was zigzagged so I just cut the S10 frame at the seem and extended it to the exact wheel base as the original. I plan on boxing the extension and throwing another cross bar through the middle for more rigidity. I want you to keep the 3600 almost everyone shortens them.just my opinion

[Flysocal]

Completed my rolling chassis a couple months ago. Stock 49 3100 frame with IFS and 4-bar rear fully boxed. I wouldn't change anything since I enjoyed the process but I'm glad it's behind me! I think it's kinda cool the truck still sits on the old frame. And all the holes line up (core support, cab, box) that's a big deal. If I had to do another say this year I would buy a ready done chassis from AME.

[joedoh]

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

JoeDoh laid out a great way to look at it! I can't agree with the MII needed all the same stuff as the S10 swap I can't imagine in a million years there is any similarities at all! You could put that motor and trans in a stock truck and not even need to do a single thing relating to pedals and gauges and harness, rad yeah, in the stock rad support, they aren't even close, not even in the same planet in related work. You COULD do all those things but they aren't absolutely necessary.

apples to apples, a 3600 with a MII and nothing else will be a completely different truck than a 3600 with a s10 swap. which is why he should consider what the end goal is. if he is doing an engine swap and lowering it, there are tens of projects in the projects section that will show the MII isnt faster or easier. if you want manual brakes under the floor, and a 45mph top speed from a stovebolt with an eaton rear end, a big drop in the 5 lug front with a MII but no drop in the rear with 8 lugs and the 3/4 springs, and 6V electronics, honestly I would just consider a drop axle instead.

an s10 swap gives not only IFS disc, but a nicely sprung rear axle with highway gearing, 5 lug all around, upgraded brakes (using the s10 booster) and mounts compatible with just about any motor and trans you could want.


I have lowered 98 rangers whitedog, their control arms are wacky. to the point of crazy camber at even a mild drop, requiring raising the upper control arm mount. going off the beaten path is great, but I wouldnt recommend a ranger based on just liking them.

[MARTINSR]

Originally Posted by Flysocal

Completed my rolling chassis a couple months ago. Stock 49 3100 frame with IFS and 4-bar rear fully boxed. I wouldn't change anything since I enjoyed the process but I'm glad it's behind me! I think it's kinda cool the truck still sits on the old frame. And all the holes line up (core support, cab, box) that's a big deal. If I had to do another say this year I would buy a ready done chassis from AME.

And honestly, boxing is not needed. Those frames weren't a Model A Fordm, they were monsters. I ran zero wheel spin with a very high torque Buick Nailhead regularly at the drags, beat the living crap out that stock frame.

Brian

[abig84]

i would figure out your wheelbase first. i dont know the similarities between the 3600 and 3800s that well but my 51 3800 has a 137 inch wheel base. so i kinda looked into a s10 swap but didnt feel comfortable stretching a s10 frame more then a foot to make it happen.

then i bought a 91 c2500 silverado extended cab and contimplated using that frame too but it was way too wide (even though i seen some of you guys using them) and was 20 inches too long so would have to hack out a large section and eventually said the heck with it im doing the stock frame.

guess it all depends on what your building, i grew up building 80s lifted 4x4 trucks so thats kinda how i want this truck to be, i want it to run and drive like a old beater truck, rough and rugged. i guess im just weird.

maybe if i decide to build a short bed 1/2 ton i would do the s10 swap if i ever do another one

[1953]

Well i appreciate everyone that chimed in, i decided to keep the frame original, im going to convert to a disc brake all around, im going to notch the frame and do a spring under axle set up, going to also do somthing loke a mustang 2 front end, also im detabing weather to do a 292 engine swap or a small block, ive been a mechanic for 10 years now and this is my first build so yeah its kind of a new to me but i have welding capabilities i have tools and i have a old truck my dad owned for 40 years lol i want to keep this as simple as possible better ride hieght, stopping power and suspension also more power just want it to be a fun driver for my kids and myself in memory of there grampa

[1953]

The engine swap will be next year i think for now i want to keep original trans and motor but just update the suspension rear end and brakes so yeah

[mongocanfly]

I looked into several options for a front end setup for mine..jaguar, durango, m2,, all were going to be in the same ballpark in price by the time you bought rebuilt or upgraded any of those choices...what I wound up with is a flatout crossmember with very low mileage c4 suspension..its not the cheapest setup but I'm well pleased with the quality...aluminum a-arms, coilovers, big brakes...not yet installed..

[Henry50]

I think you will be very happy in the long run with that decision, are you keeping it a long bed?

[55dude]

their is some much better choices in small trucks for the swap your wanting to do. the chevy could care less what the chassis is or even the powertrain, i have assisted on a handful of swaps and S-10 would be my last choice. Toyota trucks have great frames,strong rear ends... it's all personal choice.

[abig84]

Originally Posted by 55dude

their is some much better choices in small trucks for the swap your wanting to do. the chevy could care less what the chassis is or even the powertrain, i have assisted on a handful of swaps and S-10 would be my last choice. Toyota trucks have great frames,strong rear ends... it's all personal choice.

why is it everyone goes with s10s? simplicity of a v8 or probably availability? our local craigslist is infested wit s10s

[1953]

Well im prepping the frame as we speak and everything is smooth sailing

[joedoh]

Originally Posted by abig84

why is it everyone goes with s10s? simplicity of a v8 or probably availability? our local craigslist is infested wit s10s

its the aftermarket support. you can find coils and leafs and bag kits and axles and wheels and just about anything else you could want for a better price than other trucks. its like bugs in the 80s, the aftermarket was huge and upgrade parts were cheap so everyone had a lowered bug.

the example I always use is, on a road trip you have a brake problem, it wears a groove in the spindle and you need replacements. with a drop axle you are towing it home, likely no one has the right parts without ordering them. with a mustang II, you need the list, custom rotors that interchange with...?, 77 mustang spindle, granada bearings, caliper from ?, hoses from ?, master cylinder? booster? maybe they have all the parts. with an S10 you are going to find every part in stock at almost every auto parts store. the only real differences 82-03 are the front brake hoses that changed in 1991 and master cylinder/booster variances.

people who build something from scratch know how important it is keeping track of the parts and fasteners you use, and the importance of carrying spares. I have never seen anyone vehemently protest using a MII front end the way some guys pick on s10s, even though there are some limitations to using a MII front end. personally I think the MII is a great hot rod front end, its been around long enough to work out some of the big kinks. when you buy a MII though you have to have some real diligence for the placement of the parts before skillfully welding them in (or tightening the bolts more recently).

[55dude]

personally my daily is a 2010 ford ranger and i would put it under my 51 gmc without hesitation, 4 wheel disc brakes, power R&P steering, even the 4.0 outshines the chevy 4.3 and i have a couple S10's and even the toyota is a better chassis in my opinion. their is lots of good chassis choices plus motor mounts are a breeze.remember it's a hot rod!

[joedoh]

you should give it a shot, there is nothing quite like saying "I could do it better" by actually doing it better. there isnt really a shortage of people judging others real actions with their own best intentions.

[dsraven]

if you have a really good idea of what you want to end up with when you are done and can stick to plan, have good project stamina and can get your head around having the truck dissassembled with parts everywhere, have good fabrication skills and knowledge of how things work, the right tools and enough space, have some friends who will come and help lift and hold stuff, your significant other will spare you the time and you really want to do a frame swap then look around for something that is close for track width and has the stuff you want. rack and pinion steering, disc brakes front and rear, strong diff, good running driveline, etc etc. take lots of pics with dimensions as you dissassemble, bag and tag stuff, put same parts together (like interior vs exterior etc) and screw the bolts back into stuff as it comes apart so you know what size and length goes where. keep the old frame as intact as you can in the off chance that you change your mind so you can always go back to it. get an idea of the rake you like, the stance, the wheel size diameter etc. all that stuff comes into play as you assemble. you can get dimensions from other guys but they can be dependent on their tires diameter or frame rake or rocker height etc.
in the end this is hotrodding. do what YOU like but do it safely for everybody else that is driving around with their family on the same road as you are.
have fun, post pics work safe.

[HUSSEY]

Originally Posted by joedoh

its the aftermarket support. you can find coils and leafs and bag kits and axles and wheels and just about anything else you could want for a better price than other trucks.

+1 here.

When building mine I focused on using OEM parts that could be sourced from the corner auto parts store for just about everything. I think just about the only items that I couldn't get at a parts store is my Summit aluminum radiator, Ididit column, and Unisteer steering U-joints.

That was one of my reasons going with an S10 chassis.