Newb asking for fender dent repair advice?

[Gregski]

please help me straighten out the dents in my beloved 1954 3100 affectionately named Busty

anyway as you see in the pics I can remove the fenders to get at them from all angles and them being fenders I don't need to pull the dents as I can pound them out, but you tell me I need all the help/advice I can get

by the way not going to paint them, love the current patina, so same they will stay, also I'm tolerant of some scratches, imperfections as well as some rust

[Gregski]

this metal is so thick (don't get me wrong I love it) so do I heat it up I don't have an acetylene torch I have this blue bottle Bernzomatic which appears to be Propane and it couldn't burn a bugger off your finger, ha ha totally useless (I hear there is a yellow bottle jobbie that may work better?)

here are the limited tools I currently have

[franken]

Heating metal shrinks it so you don't want to do that unless the metal is stretched. Generally, the concept is to repair the last damage first and work backwards. You don't want to start bashing on things to rough out the shape since typically most of the deformed metal isn't bent--it will return when the damage is removed.
You might want to watch a lot of videos but lots of them show bad technique.

[MP&C]

I'd put the torch away unless you have some plumbing to do.


This Army publication shows some dent removal theory:


http://www.hnsa.org/wp-content/uploa...ody-repair.pdf


...or the book "Metal Bumping", sold at Eastwood is another good source.


First in, last out. In other words, looking at that wheel well, something pushing inward caused the dent in the wheel well, and by the time it stopped, it had push in a crease. The crease was the last thing created, but needs to be the first thing taken out. The metal seems so thick because that crease has the dent locked from moving. I would pull outward on the dent while hammer and dollying the crease. Yes, that sounded like possibly more than one person doing this repair. But first, I would read those two books...

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by MP&C

This Army publication shows some dent removal theory:

http://www.hnsa.org/wp-content/uploa...ody-repair.pdf

Wow thank you so much, this part was solid gold:

"Since metal bumping and finishing are simply a matter of hammering, it should be learned at the outset how to use the hammer and dolly.

The simple secret is to make every blow of the hammer strike the metal directly above the dolly or spoon.

The down stroke of the hammer drives the high spot down onto the face of the dolly block, smoothing the metal. The dolly block absorbs the shock of the hammer blow and prevents the damaged metal from being driven down too far.

At the same moment, the dolly block bounces away from the under surface of the damaged metal and quickly rebounds against the low spots, raising them before the next stroke of the hammer. With free whipping blows of the hammer on the outside surface of the metal, the two hand tools rapidly smooth the rough spot.

Never grip the dolly tightly or apply any great amount of pressure on it, because the important automatic bounce and rebound of the dolly will be lost. Most repairmen naturally develop a rhythm of 60 to 150 successive hammer blows per minute as they become skillful. Bumping is only a matter of hammering the high spots down and bringing the low spots up until the damaged metal is again even in contour. Putting the high metal down first is very important."

[Gregski]

just pulled the trigger on Amazon for one of these

Martin 168G Round Face Cross Peen Finishing Body Hammer with 12" Wood Handle - $50

if this doesn't make me a pro auto body dent puller over night nothing will, ha ha

I could have probably bought a "complete" set of hammers and dollys for that price but last time I borrowed my buddies kit I only used one hammer and one dolly out of it the entire time I had it, I'm just like that with tools I like to acquire them one at a time as I need them, after all I only use like 9 wrenches out of my million piece Craftsman kit from 30 years ago, how about you guys?

[mongocanfly]

before I knew there was a difference in quality of hammer and dollys .. I bought this set from cardboard freight..under $40...for a diy at home it works pretty good

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

before I knew there was a difference in quality of hammer and dollys .. I bought this set from cardboard freight..under $40...for a diy at home it works pretty good

"Cardboard Freight" - I haven't heard that one before, thanks for making my morning coffee shoot out of my nose! ha ha

and yup that looks very similar to the red handle set I borrowed from my buddy (I think they are all made in the same factory and painted different colors, then the blue ones go to Eastwood, ha ha, the red ones to Amazon, and yours to Cardboard Freight)

20 years ago I bought a $15 dollar orange angle grinder from Harbor Freight, took care of it and it took care of me, lasted I want to say 10 years, (I did replace the brushes in it about 3 times during that window) then it finally died, I bought a replacement black and red one I think it was just about the time they were switching their look from orange to black/red, I think the new angle grinder broke in my hands during unboxing, LOL seriously the plastic snapped as I was trying to tighten my first cut off wheel "gently" mind you - I tossed it in the trash, wasn't worth my time going back to the store for a replacement, bought a Dewalt and never looked back.

I don't recall the last time I visited "Cardboard Freight" !

[franken]

"The simple secret is to make every blow of the hammer strike the metal directly above the dolly or spoon." This is simply not true. In most cases we should hammer off dolly since hammering on dolly stretches metal that's already stretched, making things worse.

As I mentioned, much if not most info about bodywork on the internet will be found to be untrue. The key to metal bumping is the classic tiny book and with some effort can be grabbed on the internet as a pdf.

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by franken

"The simple secret is to make every blow of the hammer strike the metal directly above the dolly or spoon." This is simply not true. In most cases we should hammer off dolly since hammering on dolly stretches metal that's already stretched, making things worse.

As I mentioned, much if not most info about bodywork on the internet will be found to be untrue...

You calling the US Army a liar? ha ha ha

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by franken

Heating metal shrinks it so you don't want to do that unless the metal is stretched.

Actually quite the opposite holds true, don't we heat up stuck fasteners in order to loosen them up, heating metal expands it!

[PGSigns]

Heating can work both ways. Google shrinking disc. You will need much more than the one hammer. The harbor freight set is a good start. I learned body work in the mid 70's and was tought by a guy that did not like filler. So a fender like that that would be worked with a hammer and a dolly. The creases and some of the bends will need some shrinking and that is where the heat and a wet rag comes in. There are some good videos on line for shrinking and hammer and dolly work.
Jimmy

[Gregski]

so here's some progress pics, not bad for a first pass, once the body hammer shows up and I get a reversible high/low dolly I will make another pass

[nsb29]

I would sand the old paint off then as you get it closer you can use a guide coat and a sanding block to help find your highs and lows

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by nsb29

I would sand the old paint off then as you get it closer you can use a guide coat and a sanding block to help find your highs and lows

Thank you

[PGSigns]

Now it is time to slow down and work the little dents out. Go get the hammer and dolly set from harbor freight. Will give you more options for very little money. Some times you will hammer from the inside and sometimes from the outside. The less you hit it and the better the hit the less you will stretch the metal.
Jimmy

[Gregski]

thank you all for your advice, this is the High-Low Crown Shrinking Dolly I picked up also for $50 bucks. quality tools folks, quality tools, lol

[KShortell]

Like others have said, it's hammer and dolly time. It's a skill I've dabble in, but have not yet perfected. It's an ART! Good luck. :-)

[Gregski]

and here's the other hammer a High-Crown cross peen hammer I ordered, my logic being if one is a wood handle and the other is a black handle than I can easily reach for the right one even after a few beers, ha ha

on a serious note, the wood one is flat and what I have amassed so far is that is ideal from hitting a curved surface such as a fender from the outside to flatten bumps while backing up the inside with a convex (raised curve) dolly

now the black hammer is the opposite it is curved rather than flat, I will use that bad boy to hit the fenders from the inside to raise any dimples

I know there is way more to this but just bear with me (simple mind at work here!)

and as always thank you all for reading and offerin' advice, much appreciate it

[Gregski]

and here's the other side, I definitely have plenty of pieces to practice on, ha ha

these repairs are noisy but so much fun, and you get to see the results then and there - it's so therapeutic

[Gregski]

I also ordered this Eastwood Panelbeater Metal Fabrication Sandbag Support and Flexibility Metal Beating and Shaping Panels Work Panel Beater also $50 bucks, man seems like everything runs $50 bucks these days, ha ha

can anybody make a suggestion on what kinda sand to use to fill it, as I'm sure not all sand was created equal

the plan is to use this bag to reverse pound out that spare tire indentation in the driver side rear fender - good times ahead!

[Zippi]

I want to see how the spare tire area turns out when you get finished.

[Gregski]

Originally Posted by Zippi

I want to see how the spare tire area turns out when you get finished.

Yup you and me both, here's what it looks like now

[mongocanfly]

for the bag..the finer the sand the harder the surface...course sand has more movement to it...mostly your choice....I use a bag of #8 lead birdshot

wheres Richard? MP&C...
im not sure that spare tire indent will flip by hammering and ever look right...im betting there was a lot of metal stretching going on when they formed that...
I don't know if you saw where I removed a spare tire notch on mine, but I took 2 fenders and made one
I'm wondering if itd be easier to cut out the indent ,flip it over, and weld it back in...but I'm not sure what the shape is and if it would ever match....a profile gauge would tell you a lot
but who knows ..it might turn wrong side out with no problems

[franken]

Originally Posted by Gregski

Actually quite the opposite holds true, don't we heat up stuck fasteners in order to loosen them up, heating metal expands it!

Sure, until it cools off. This is basic. Feel free to research via the internet.