gas milage improve part 2

[wlf89]

i just checked my rear end ratio to make sure of what i have and it is a 3.73 rather than a 4.11 so as far as changing the ratio do you think it would be worth changing to a 3.08

[wlf89]

is there any kind of trans that will fit with my bench seat other than t5

[Dingfodgy]

Originally Posted by wlf89

is there any kind of trans that will fit with my bench seat other than t5

T56 (w/mid-shift mod), NV3500, MY6, TH700-R4, TH200-4R, Tremec TKO, Richmond 5-speed. TH350/400 w/ Gear Vendors O/U. I'm sure there are others too.

[oldblue1968chevy]

why not go with the s10 trans?

[Hezie]

Richmond is questionable. The shifter is waaaaaay back and you have more gear than they recommend.But it is a blast to drive.

[wlf89]

Originally Posted by oldblue1968chevy

why not go with the s10 trans?

i have heard they might not hold up if you ever abuse it. i dont do that much but everynow and again i will im 21yr old so dont think i will out grow soon

[wlf89]

Originally Posted by Dingfodgy

T56 (w/mid-shift mod), NV3500, MY6, TH700-R4, TH200-4R, Tremec TKO, Richmond 5-speed. TH350/400 w/ Gear Vendors O/U. I'm sure there are others too.

should have mentioned straight shift only

[bigbadjohn84]

what size motor are you running? anything with more power or torque than a stock 4.3 will kill a s10 t5. ask me how I know

[wlf89]

i would also like to have an older one that would not have hydraulic clutch and manual speedo what year did they start putting overdrives in the straight shifts and also are they all 5 speed sorry for all questions just wanting to get idea how much trouble it would be to change stock 3 speed out to a overdrive

['72customdeluxe]

Originally Posted by wlf89

i just checked my rear end ratio to make sure of what i have and it is a 3.73 rather than a 4.11 so as far as changing the ratio do you think it would be worth changing to a 3.08

If you do it yourself and spend the majority of your time above 50, sure. But 600$ for someone else to do it (approximate, with parts) will buy alot more fuel than fuel mileage. I'd bet you would get more out of buying a wideband o2 sensor setup for 200$ and tuning with it

[wlf89]

i got a 350 motor big bad john

i think the trans would be the biggest improve if i can get some more info on what i would need to know

[68Stepbed]

I wouldn't change to a 3.08 gear. You will be burning up clutches with the 3.08 and a 3-speed tranny. Your best bet will probably be to start looking into the aftermarket. The TKO500 or TKO600 5-speeds will probably be your best bet without changing gear ratios. They're actual overdrive trannys.

The Richmond trannys are more of what I would call an underdrive trans. They have a lower first gear with a 1.00:1 5th gear and they recommend a 2.76 or higher rear gear.

Of course there's also the T56 6speeds. You can still pick these up used and just change it over to a mechanical throwout bearing instead of the hydraulic most of them will have. Changing to a hydraulic isn't as tough as it may seem though.

As far as T5 trannys, I'm not real experienced with them, but I know they won't take alot of abuse behind a stout small block. They tend to hold up well behind V6's and stock sb V8's as long as they're not abused too much.

[jku72]

I'm sure you'll make your decision likely based on budget, and what you'd like to have regardless.
A 3.07 rear gear, used, is quite cheap. I swapped my old 3.73's for free. I installed them myself, with a new seal, crush sleeve and nut for about $35. By getting the entire gear/carrier/shim pack from the old rear end, I was able to bolt it in, and only make a minor shim change on the carrier bearings.
For a total investment of $35, I got a truck that cruises nice on the highway, and still has decent acceleration. Granted, my truck has a 4 speed, but I generally take off in second anyway. I've driven across the country from Portland Oregon to Maine, and have driven around New England for 6 years on this setup. I've never changed or even thought about the clutch.
A new 5 speed is a best solution, if you have a lot more money than I have, that is pretty clear.
But I'm just saying, don't poo poo the 3.07 rear so fast.

[71meangreenc10]

I have a 3.07/08 (cant remember) in my shortbed with a three speed saginaw and it works fine, not going to burn the tires off like the 3.73 did, but I didnt build it for speed. Put a 2.76 in first and the truck couldn't pull itself off a curb.....

Smitty

[raycow]

Originally Posted by wlf89

what year did they start putting overdrives in the straight shifts and also are they all 5 speed sorry for all questions just wanting to get idea how much trouble it would be to change stock 3 speed out to a overdrive

About 1982 if you count the T-5 in the S-10 and the MY6/A833 in the C-10. The MY6 is a 4 speed, with 4th being overdrive.

However, if you count the 3 speed with the Borg-Warner overdrive, that goes back to 1955 in Chevy cars and trucks, and is still the easiest swap if you have a 3 speed now.

Ray

[capev86]

just remember that 66 up saginaw's are full synchro on first gear whereas the earlier units were old school (full stop before putting it in first). not sure if you can use the o/d unit from an earlier donor car on the later trans. also, i hear some fords had heavier duty parts that are compatable but that may only apply to the earlier units.

i want to change the saginaw in my 72 burb over to an overdrive unit for obvious reasons. i changed out the 4.57 (3/4 ton) for a 4.10 third member and it runs around real nice around town thanks to a 4 barrel swap w/ edelbrock intake to maximize low end power in that 307 but an overdrive would still be nice on long highway drives and allow me to go steady at 60+ mph.

i know my dad's '87 burb was like night and day when we swapped out that lame 3.08 for the 3.73 rear axle out of his '84. gas mileage didn't suffer as the 3.08 is just too soft unless you are at big block or diesel power levels.

best compromise is an aggressive rear gear with an overdrive ratio to compensate. even a 4.56 w/ a .7 overdrive (700r4, etc) would be close to a 3.08. some of those 6 speeds have 2 overdrive ratios and a choice between .62 and .50 or so top gears so you can run a serious stump puller and still be able to drive on the highway.

[raycow]

Originally Posted by capev86

just remember that 66 up saginaw's are full synchro on first gear whereas the earlier units were old school (full stop before putting it in first). not sure if you can use the o/d unit from an earlier donor car on the later trans. also, i hear some fords had heavier duty parts that are compatable but that may only apply to the earlier units.

The Borg-Warner overdrives have to be treated as a factory assembly. That means you can't install the overdrive unit on a transmission which wasn't originally so equipped without modifying the case, and you can't swap the OD from one type of transmission to another (like from a SM318 to a SM326).

Ford and a couple of other makers offered the stronger R11 OD behind their larger displacement engines at one time or another, but GM never did. R11 parts can't be installed in the R10 OD that was used by Chevy and the R11 unit can't be bolted to any of the common GM 3 speed transmissions. If you could find one of the T85 transmissions used in late 50s-early 60s high performance Pontiacs you can adapt the Ford R11 to that with some machine work. However, those Pontiac transmissions are so scarce now as to be collectors' items.

In practical terms, you don't have to worry about the strength of the R10 if you use the overdrve as intended (mainly in 3rd gear). I have had a half dozen of these overdrives, all of which I wired for full manual control (meaning the OD could be used in any forward gear) and was able to damage only one of them. That one was in a GTO, and I seriously abused it many times (full throttle in 1st with the OD engaged) before the OD died. Even after that, I could still drive the car normally in direct drive with no problems.

Ray

[capev86]

thanks.....good info!!

maybe someday someone will find a way to make it work. too bad these babies aren't available as beefed up repops. a conversion kit for all us guys running the standard 3 speed would be an awesome alternative considering the price just to buy a good used core and all the electronic hardware.

[capev86]

this is interesting......

http://slo.craigslist.org/pts/1834395233.html

[raycow]

Originally Posted by capev86

this is interesting......

http://slo.craigslist.org/pts/1834395233.html

That was made by someone who really appreciates the B-W O/D. If I had any kind of Ford I would buy it without even thinking twice. In fact, it would be highly tempting to take it apart and put it on a GM T-10 case.

It is a real shame that GM didn't go that route instead of the dreadful Doug Nash unit they used on 80s Corvettes.

Thanks for sharing.

Now maybe you can educate me. Since you live in Maine and that ad is in California, can you tell me how you did a national CL seach so you could find stuff that is outside your local area?

Ray

[wlf89]

so can i use a Borg-Warner over drive on my stock 3 speed manual trans if so where could i find one

[raycow]

No, you must use a transmission that already has the B-W overdrive on it. As an assembly, this will replace the 3 speed that is in your truck now.

Salvage yards sometimes have these, but the best places to look are ebay and craigslist.

Ray

[wlf89]

what about changing the actual gears in my current trans is that an option

[raycow]

Your present transmission (or any other 3 speed) is 1:1 in high gear. There is nothing you can do to change that.

Ray

[wlf89]

ok now let me ask you this if i could get a 700r4 for a decent price what would i have to do to make it work. could i put a auto floor shift in and keep my oringinal column and what would be required to make it work