The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network







Register or Log In To remove these advertisements.

Go Back   The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network > General Truck Forums > Paint & Bodywork

Web 67-72chevytrucks.com


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-15-2021, 07:26 PM   #1
Estock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Nashville
Posts: 25
Powder Coat Predicament

Hi all,

I've hit my first snag with my 59 Apache build. After finding my paint colors, I took my paint pray out to my local powder coating operation a couple weeks ago. They use Prismatic powders and have a ton of chips on the wall to choose from. I found a REALLY close match that I checked in daylight, under LEDs, etc. It looked great.

Flash forward to today. I went to pick up my chassis and wheels that had been powder coated in the color I picked. The the color is WAAAAAY different. They're not even in the same ballpark.

The powder coating operation is claiming this variance is normal, but being Prismatic offers 6500 different colors I can't see how they would be this different. Hell, the wheels look noticeably different than the frame despite being done at the same time with the same color. I've called Prismatic but haven't heard back yet.

I'm at a loss. I'll either need to strip everything and redo it, hoping the coating shop helps me out on the cost, or deal with it as is. They mentioned I could topcoat it with a different color, but I'm reading mixed reviews on that.

Any tips or recommendations how to proceed? Any insight you guys can offer would really be appreciated.
Attached Images
    
Estock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2021, 10:18 PM   #2
Ziegelsteinfaust
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Temple City
Posts: 3,554
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

That is not good being so wildly different.

I too have heard too from a friend who worked for a powder coater for awhile.
Ziegelsteinfaust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2021, 11:10 PM   #3
roll_the_dice
Registered User
 
roll_the_dice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Manlius, NY
Posts: 1,698
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

I do some small job powder coating for personal use and I have used Prismatic powders fairly exclusively...I have never had a huge difference in a sample chip and the powder.

The problem with coating a different color (over current color) to the part is twofold in my untrained opinion...

1. The underlying color will make the new topcoat color a different shade, even slightly...that is how you can get some different shades and effects.

2. The only time I have used a color over a color, usually when I use clear powder for clear coat...or when I do a candy color with silver flake as the first coat...the 2nd or 3rd color doesn't want to adhere to the first color as well...I usually use something call hot flocking where the part is heated and then powder coated...so it sticks to the hot part and melts immediately, but then still needs to be cured in an oven.

I would ask the shop did they do anything to the part before powder coating it...just to make sure they didn't put another color under it for some reason which could change the shade.

Unfortunately if it were me, I would want to strip it and start over with a different powder coater...or ask them to see the powder they used...it should have the prismatic # and color name on the bag or bottle the powder is stored in.

Sorry this happened to you! Good luck.

Last edited by roll_the_dice; 01-16-2021 at 12:15 AM.
roll_the_dice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 06:46 AM   #4
ChevyRacefan
Registered User
 
ChevyRacefan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Newton,N.C.
Posts: 317
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Is this power job have a clear over the base. if so.
the paint book chip is before a over coat.
ChevyRacefan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 05:38 PM   #5
Estock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Nashville
Posts: 25
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by roll_the_dice View Post
I do some small job powder coating for personal use and I have used Prismatic powders fairly exclusively...I have never had a huge difference in a sample chip and the powder.

The problem with coating a different color (over current color) to the part is twofold in my untrained opinion...

1. The underlying color will make the new topcoat color a different shade, even slightly...that is how you can get some different shades and effects.

2. The only time I have used a color over a color, usually when I use clear powder for clear coat...or when I do a candy color with silver flake as the first coat...the 2nd or 3rd color doesn't want to adhere to the first color as well...I usually use something call hot flocking where the part is heated and then powder coated...so it sticks to the hot part and melts immediately, but then still needs to be cured in an oven.

I would ask the shop did they do anything to the part before powder coating it...just to make sure they didn't put another color under it for some reason which could change the shade.

Unfortunately if it were me, I would want to strip it and start over with a different powder coater...or ask them to see the powder they used...it should have the prismatic # and color name on the bag or bottle the powder is stored in.

Sorry this happened to you! Good luck.
Thanks for the response. There is nothing under the powder. It was blasted and went straight to powder.

I'm at the point where I want to strip it as well, but it's a ton of work. Maybe a chemical dip is a cheaper option. Doing this all over again, I'll be $3500 into this. It's getting expensive.

The powder used was all the same prismatic # according to the shop - From the sample I matched my paint sample with to the powder that went on the wheels to the powder that went on the frame. All three are different. The shop is claiming the thickness of the powder may be part of this variance. I'm no expert, but it seems unlikely.
Estock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 05:39 PM   #6
Estock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Nashville
Posts: 25
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChevyRacefan View Post
Is this power job have a clear over the base. if so.
the paint book chip is before a over coat.
The original powder chip I matched it to was without clear. Everything I had done was also without clear. All matte.
Estock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 06:42 PM   #7
LS short box
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Carlos MN
Posts: 1,888
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

The company I used to work for we had our own powder coat shop to do our machine frames and out side work. What ever you do don't spray new powder over the current powder. As said above it won't turn out well. Sand blasting will take awhile because the powder is plastic and the sand kind of bounces off the powder.
I know you picked out a color you like but the best powder colors are the ones the they spray everyday.
If a customer came to us with a "custom" color typically referred to a "RAL" number we always did a spray out card and sent it to the customer. Not just sample card from the powder supplier.
LS short box is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 07:12 PM   #8
skip99
Registered User
 
skip99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: mt vernon, oh
Posts: 867
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by LS short box View Post
The company I used to work for we had our own powder coat shop to do our machine frames and out side work. What ever you do don't spray new powder over the current powder. As said above it won't turn out well. Sand blasting will take awhile because the powder is plastic and the sand kind of bounces off the powder.
I know you picked out a color you like but the best powder colors are the ones the they spray everyday.
If a customer came to us with a "custom" color typically referred to a "RAL" number we always did a spray out card and sent it to the customer. Not just sample card from the powder supplier.
Yep, always do a spray out sample.....
__________________
Tami's 51 build

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=428878
skip99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 08:21 PM   #9
Estock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Nashville
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by skip99 View Post
Yep, always do a spray out sample.....
To be clear, the sample they had on the wall was an actual spray out, not a chip from Prismatic. I should have had them do a spray out from the actual batch of powder we received. Live and learn
Posted via Mobile Device
Estock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 08:46 PM   #10
nsb29
Senior Member
 
nsb29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: new smyrna beach fl / 29 palms cal
Posts: 1,727
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Have you paid them yet? I’d make him strip it and redo it I personally have never been a fan of powder especially when you put on bare metal it’s impossible to touch up and if you live in a moist area and you get a chip there is nothing to stop the rust Creep! My thought is they used the wrong color if the manufacturer sent the wrong color then they should be responsible . I wouldn’t do anything until you’ve talk to the manufacturer, I have heard that it can be stripped in a burn off oven ???
__________________
Hand made A/C vent manifolds for 64-66 trucks adapts any aftermarket A/C to OEM vent

Last edited by nsb29; 01-16-2021 at 09:01 PM.
nsb29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2021, 09:28 PM   #11
Estock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Nashville
Posts: 25
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by nsb29 View Post
Have you paid them yet? I’d make him strip it and redo it I personally have never been a fan of powder especially when you put on bare metal it’s impossible to touch up and if you live in a moist area and you get a chip there is nothing to stop the rust Creep! My thought is they used the wrong color if the manufacturer sent the wrong color then they should be responsible . I wouldn’t do anything until you’ve talk to the manufacturer, I have heard that it can be stripped in a burn off oven ???
Yep. I have paid them, but I expressed my dissatisfaction with the color. When I picked it up, I didn't have my paint spray out to compare it to.

I'll be talking with Prismatic when they open up Monday.
Estock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2021, 04:36 AM   #12
ChevyRacefan
Registered User
 
ChevyRacefan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Newton,N.C.
Posts: 317
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by Estock View Post
To be clear, the sample they had on the wall was an actual spray out, not a chip from Prismatic. I should have had them do a spray out from the actual batch of powder we received. Live and learn
Posted via Mobile Device
The spray out card might have ,had a undercoat/primer on it before thy sprayed that color on it. and you are stating your parts don't. No primer coat?
ChevyRacefan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2021, 10:24 AM   #13
nsb29
Senior Member
 
nsb29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: new smyrna beach fl / 29 palms cal
Posts: 1,727
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

I believe it isn’t any different than paint, one drop off when mixing it it’s not going to match. As far as the parts being different that could be because it wasn’t thoroughly mixed especially if the shop received it in more than one container. When I painted my truck I bought two gallons so I batched them to ensure they were the same. Hopefully they will work with you
__________________
Hand made A/C vent manifolds for 64-66 trucks adapts any aftermarket A/C to OEM vent
nsb29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2021, 05:52 PM   #14
LS short box
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Carlos MN
Posts: 1,888
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

I can check with my powder coat guy I used to work with and ask him what is best practice for getting the color you want. Doesn't help the current problem but may help going forward. Also I will ask about a primer coat of powder before the top coat. I've never heard of that before.
LS short box is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2021, 10:07 PM   #15
roll_the_dice
Registered User
 
roll_the_dice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Manlius, NY
Posts: 1,698
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

I've never done a primer coat of powder. I go straight from sand blasting and cleaning the piece to the color powder I am using. The only time I have used multiple colors was on some brake calipers that was a candy red color. It had a silver base coat, then the red tint coat and finally a clear coat, but never a primer coat.
roll_the_dice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2021, 11:54 PM   #16
ChevyRacefan
Registered User
 
ChevyRacefan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Newton,N.C.
Posts: 317
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by roll_the_dice View Post
I've never done a primer coat of powder. I go straight from sand blasting and cleaning the piece to the color powder I am using. The only time I have used multiple colors was on some brake calipers that was a candy red color. It had a silver base coat, then the red tint coat and finally a clear coat, but never a primer coat.
Yes, but the sprat out card id metal might have to keep rust away while in storage , till sprayed.
It could be guy spraying grabbed the wrong color and they sprayed it.
The spray out not baked long enough to flow out. ?
A screw up in the formula when mixed to spray, if not a premixed powder color.
ChevyRacefan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2021, 11:57 AM   #17
SkidmoreGarage
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 335
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Okay, so I feel your pain. But devil's advocate.

You will never see the wheels and frame at the same time and with the same lighting.

If your need to find a compromise, you could focus on getting the wheels right.
SkidmoreGarage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2021, 05:34 PM   #18
LS short box
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Carlos MN
Posts: 1,888
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

My .02 is they sprayed the wrong color. You can be off by one RAL number and the powder once cured will look quite different.
LS short box is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2021, 11:09 PM   #19
ChevyRacefan
Registered User
 
ChevyRacefan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Newton,N.C.
Posts: 317
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

Quote:
Originally Posted by LS short box View Post
My .02 is they sprayed the wrong color. You can be off by one RAL number and the powder once cured will look quite different.
Could be, I am thinking it be a r.p.i.t.a. to remove it, and start over.
ChevyRacefan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2021, 12:29 PM   #20
Estock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Nashville
Posts: 25
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

I've sent my paint sprayout to Prismatic to color match. I'll get a pound of powder and have them to a test spray-out. I plan to compare from there and make a decision.

The bed of the truck will lif up to expose the air management as well as the fuel tank and batteries, so I'll be seeing the chassis regularly. My guts says we're stripping it and starting all over.
Estock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2021, 02:36 PM   #21
Custom 68
Registered User
 
Custom 68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 2,930
Re: Powder Coat Predicament

I think you have answered your own question. You are not happy with it and wont be until it is corrected. It is a lot easier to accomplish that now than after its completed. You will look at it for years and always know its not 100% the way you wanted it.
It is a tough call and an expense but unfortunately and ultimately I think it is best for your future sanity to bite the bullet now.
All that said it does seem to have a lot of flake in it so the color is different at the different angles. Your wheels for example look like different shades depending on the photo you look at. Somebody with experience in powder can probably answer but I know paint can be tricky depending on the angle, distance and ect on how it is sprayed. This one may be a tough one to get exact?
good luck and it will be awesome when complete.
Dave
__________________
Dave
1968 Custom Chevy with turbo charged 5.3 gen III 4l80e swap
1967-71 GMC 3/4 ton long step 4x4 (not sure what year exactly?)
"A good friend will bail you out of jail...but a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "that was frekin awesome".
"If it doesn't fit force it...If it breaks then it needed to be replaced anyway!"
Custom 68 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:57 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright 1997-2022 67-72chevytrucks.com