Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

This setup is what I have been looking for. I should finish up the install this weekend. Top quality components and company. It will be while for I get to put on the ground since I just started my build. :metal:

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Yes, you would loose about 1" in total available drop/compression range.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

It would be used for drag/street racing and daily driving. 4' drop it has now is plenty

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Is that all? The CPP notch added at least 2" additional clearance on my truck with the provided shorty bump stops, and even more when considering where the stock bumpstops were setting the rearend.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Rob,

Is the yellow truck bed floor wood or steel? Also, did the owner cut holes in the trailing arm cross member to run the exhaust through?

Thanks

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

This truck has a wood floor. Yes, the OE crossmember was ported for the exhaust.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Update. Cory brought his truck out to Cruisin the Smokies for two days of Auto-X fun, and we did a little tuning. The truck showed us very quickly that without the ability to tune the front shocks, the trucks performance wall came up pretty quick. We could have 1) increased neg. camber, 2) added more positive caster, 3) added some toe-out, but we were trying to keep it in very street friendly trim. Also, we were having too much fun to get real serious. The truck handled great, and drives smoother and more predictable than ever. Cory did finish 2nd in the truck class - first was a supercharged Trail Blazer SS - hard to beat the ABS and traction control. With some driving under his belt now, Cory is eyeing a WideRide IFS to replace the current set up. If you are interested in the Hotchkis TVS components and brakes, it is now for sale.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I may have a video of Corey's truck. I'll look for it this evening.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Hi
how much is the tvs system?

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I see that shock placement was already addressed but maybe you would consider input for future iterations or options.

Why not incorporate the coilover mounts into the trackbar mount and behind the axle? or at least on the c-notch brackets to bring them more vertical and closer to the rear axle?

Wouldnt this allow the shock to control compression and rebound more effeciently?

Of course doing either of those would severely limit exhaust routing for a rear mounted gas tank. I would rather have my exhaust exit in front of the rear axle personally.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the way I see it the shock can be tuned to perform the same no matter what angle it's at -- it's effectiveness is lessened at greater angles necessitating a stiffer shock for equivalent performance to a vertical shock. Angling the shock might make it easier to find a shock since it becomes longer, physically.

The downside to an angled shock that I can see is that as suspension travels, the shock angle changes. This results in a inconsistent shock performance throughout the suspension travel, as the performance varies with shock angle. On the other hand, maybe you want the shock's performance to vary in this way due to your suspension design. I have not seen any designs that claim to take this into consideration though.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Way back in the late '90's, we made a coil over mount set up for these trucks that mounted the shock behind the axle. - Just like what everyone else is doing now. It's all about leverage, so the farther back you are from the trailing arm pivot, the less the shock is leveraged. A shock/spring behind the axle is great for hauling rocks, but looses it's ability to help the tire stay stuck to the road when the truck is empty (no rocks). While our coil-over may seam 'out of place' compared to others, think about the location of the factory coil spring, not too far from our new mounting points. As to shock valving/action, it's just a question of matching the valving to the ratios and weights. Just like the difference of front shocks and rear shocks, 50% leveraged compared to 1-1 ratio. Also, many suspension designs incorporate the shock angle as it relates to the suspension travel angle, which is usually no straight up and down, as the suspension travels in arcs, and the shock needs to stay close to 90 degrees to the suspension motion, not 90 degrees to the ground.
Thanks for the input, and all of those things are a factor we need to think about.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Can you explain why this is?

I'm imagining two shock locations, one in front and one behind the axle and both mounted to the frame rails. Both locations are selected for identical shock angle and length. I'm considering the frame to be actually stiff between the two shock mounting points. The only difference that I can think of here is the force applied to the shock due to leverage, which can be compensated for with different valving.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

well, yes and no. Yes, it's leverage and force, it's also shaft speed of the shock. And, while it is reasonably true that custom valving and spring rates can be fitted to be a perfect match, the question is, are they available? Look at the current crop of aftermarket coil-over. Do they spec 'front' or 'rear' valve codes? Remember that most 'front' shocks are at close to 2 to 1 leverage ratio, and most 'rear' shocks are at a 1 to 1 ratio, or close. Factor in the weights and it is clear that the typical front shock need 4x the valving resistance as compared to a rear shock (very wide liberal estimate for discussion) While they do offer adjustable valving, it is all in a set range. So , our job is to use what is available, test it on a shock dyno, set the valving range and then design a way to use off the shelf parts and make them work to the best of their ability.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

From what I read just now, shock leverage ratio is the ratio of wheel movement to shock shaft movement -- I might be misunderstanding though, because the only way to get a 1:1 ratio would be to have a shock mounted along the axis of axle motion, correct?

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Yes, that is correct. to simplify the discussion, I am painting with a VERY wide brush. There are way too many factors to discuss them all here down to the last detail. So, for our basic discussion, a shock mounted to the axle, and somewhat close to straight up/down, would be somewhere near a 1 to 1 ratio.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Hey Rob,

Any updates on the notch? I am going to order the Wide Ride front but holding out until the rear notch is done. ;)

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Rob,

When you guys went to the 12" 250lb spring did you change the shock? Or did he stick with the C213-W shock (7.00" shock stroke)?

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Parts are here. I worked with Tina and Jessica get them ordered. Great ladies over there and AWESOME customer service. When the coilovers arrived ViKing sent the wrong springs. Jessica took care of everything and got new springs shipped the next day.

The only bummer was a couple of the parts arrived with powered coat nicked up. I assume this happened during shipping since I wouldn't think No Limit would let them leave the shop this way.

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psp1m10zun.jpg

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Just curious, did the heims come with dust boots? IDK if that's required but I keep seeing people say that heims don't last as long as OE stuff and I'm wondering if that would help longevity...

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Nope. Just came with a bunch of bubble wrap around everything.

I haven't heard that before them not lasting as long.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

So how much trouble to put one of these under a 73-87?

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Sorry about the powder coat. They definitely didn't leave our shop that way. As for the life of the hiems, there are two huge factors. 1) what are they used for? and 2) the quality of the heim. So, for #1, the heims are for bracing or the panhard rod, which has less motion and load than say, a 4-bar link or and A-arm. and #2, for the panhard, we use the best quality CM delron lined heims we can get. If they get loose before 50,000 miles, we'll replace them. - If they get loose after 50,000 miles, hey, you drove the wheels off it, spend $30 on new heims.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

We haven't done this, and have no plans to do so. The goal for the T.A. kit for the 63-72 C10's was to provide a true bolt-in kit (no welding at all) that would ride and handle as well as our FatBar 4-bar. So, to put a trailing arm in a later C1500, there would be welding involved, so, why not use our proven FatBar system? Also, the shape of the frame rail has a lot to do with how successful this swap would be. Just because you 'can' do it, doesn't mean you should.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I am half away done with installing everything. Finishing up the upper shock mount brackets and started on the panhard bar bracket. Man removing rivets are fun.

From the parts list I notice that the Upper Shock Mount Bracket and Panhard bar Bracket don't come with mounting hardware. Has anyone else ran into this? I seems like I am 11 bolts short.

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psmcxjunva.jpg

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psn4xbfsuo.jpg

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Has anyone ran in to an issue with the reference hole for mounting the panhard backet?

Compared to Rob's picture in post #9 the reference hole on my frame looks lower. When I mount the bracket to this hole the bottom two holes don't have frame to bolt the bracket to.

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psjl2ue419.jpg

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps7p6hek37.jpg

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I too noticed the reference hole issue. I used the bottom right hole instead of the middle one for reference. I believe I purchased the first trailing arm kit that they sold. I too was short on bolts, just ran to local store and grabbed more. Ill post pictures tomorrow absolutely love the product and everything they have. They will be will be my go to for any and all future projects. You will not find a better company to work with customer service wise not to mention their top quality products.

Also CPP C-notch kit works well with the trailing arm kit as seen on the yellow test truck.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Sorry guys. We missed the bolt count for the shock and panhard mounts. This has been amended, but if you need them, just call and we'll ship them out. Also, it would seem that some frames have different holes in the back. We will be posting up a measurement in the directions (see 'Tech Center' on our site) and adding this to the instructions. Thanks for the feedback, everyone is having great results with this package. Ride quality and handling is un-matched. The small details will be sorted out. Thanks again.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Would love to see some pictures of your truck Nick. What size wheel combo you running?

Thanks Rob. I am very happy with the protect and your guys customer service. I am ready to order the Wide Ride front when the c-notch is ready. ;)

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I am stuck at mounting the panhard bar bracket also. I have 2 frames a 71 and 72 neither have the mentioned holes. I will finish mounting it up when dimensions are available. I have plenty of other work to do

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I am running the wide ride ifs with 17x10.5 CCW classic 3pc. The rear will be 18x as big as I can fit. Ill have a build posted once I have time. I went to take pictures today to post and them when noticed I cracked one of the coil over eyelets. I didn't tighten the trailing arm to the rear diff, I guess the weight cracked it. No worries Rob is helping me out in replacing it. Next item will be the rear sway bar from No Limit.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Are you running 2" blocks in the rear? What springs you running?

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

I am running the ride tech single adjust front and rear. I don't know the spring rates, I assume the standard weights from no limit. I will be running 2 inch blocks in the rear possibly a heavier spring up front as well.

What is everyone running on these kits?

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

There are two swap kits that I know of. If you want to do it, check out CPP's kit and avoid the other one. Hot rods to hell might do it as well but I think they are kind of more into one off setups last time I looked into them. They could be a third option. If you want some details about the kit I have PM me and I'll go over them with you. It shouldn't be two hard of a swap with good parts.

Rob, I'd be interested to hear your opinions on the downfalls of the trailing arm setup in a 73-87. I have a swap kit for my truck and a 72 rear axle so I wasn't supposed to have to do any welding. But parts of the kit don't fit very well and I never got an answer on a fix so its been sitting in a pile in my garage while I work on other stuff. I want to start back on installing it soon though. I'm going to have to modify parts of it and probably the floor of the cab so it will fit the way I think it should.

Not looking for you to specifically bash the available kits per say (I can do that on my own) but what problems the suspension design would have in the later frame.

Thanks!

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Any updates on the measurements? I checked the site and theres nothing up.

Here is where I have it mocked up. It cant go much more forward without hitting the bolt for the cross member.

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psspqbtc54.jpg

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps8jt8lhcf.jpg

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psogay96wo.jpg

Also is there a L/R for the trailing arm brackets?

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psqmdp6lky.jpg

Thanks

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Sory for the delay. Here is a spec on the mount location of the panhard rod bracket for chassis that don't have the pic location hole.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Lookin good. There is no difference between L.H. & R.H. mounts for the trailing arms. Panhard mount spec is now online. Thanks.

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Thanks for the dimensions Rob!

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Hey Rob,

I am ready for the c-notch.... :D

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...ps0jxwydz3.jpg

http://i483.photobucket.com/albums/r...psiiixkjjn.jpg

Re: No Limit Trailing Arm Rear Suspension
 

Why not just any other notch? Isn't the panhard specifically designed to work with the CPP notch?