Tips on doing a Frame Off
 

To all of you guys that have done a frame off resto..i will be doing mine in about 3 months and was wondering what kind of troubles you ran into or things that you thought you might be able to reuse that you weren't able to..also is there anything that i need to buy that would not be usuall replacement stuff that i need to start looking for now??

basically just curious on your experences and lessons learned..(that's what this board is about right!!)

Thanks

Rick

I'm still in the middle of my first frame off. The first thing to realize is if you plan on a time frame to complete don't be surprised if it takes longer than expected. If you do most of the work yourself (like me) when you get to the point of some reassembly of new and painted parts it's worth the blood and sweat. Good Luck and keep us posted :cf:

the first thing is to decide which direction you are going. i.e. original resto, custom, wild, etc. Then you can accumulate catalogs and resources (this site is the best resource) and begin your parts buying! yippeee!! Got to make sure your tools are up to the task (especially if doing the work yourself). I have had to delay my time schedule several times because of equipment upgrades taking my extra cash from the project parts. I am currently entertaining the idea of an air compressor upgrade to the tune of $700, so there is a money-driven delay.

I'm in the fifth year of my 2 year frame off restoration. :) Actually I bought another parts truck and I am doing the frame up build on that frame. One hint of advice, Buy a bunch of the ziploc freezer bags that you can write on and a pack of sharpies. Keep the nuts and bolts to each part in a seperate baggie. You will end up with probably 25 bags, but you won't have to play "guess which bolt I need" when the rebuild time comes around. I will never take another thing apart without doing this. As far as time, take what you honestly think will be enough time and double it. As far as money, take what you think it will cost and double it. I am not kidding. This is pretty much par for the course and I'd bet most of the guys on here will agree with me. Last, but not least, take lots of pictures for the guys on that cool website you hang out at. :)
...........Jerry

Before the first bolt is turned make sure you have a real good mental idea of how it will look like after it is done. Nothing sux more than having everything painted/powdercoated/plated then finding something that needs to be welded.

that`s good advice. i always take all of my wiring and label the ends/connectors with tape and mark them too. the biggest problem i`m running into is lifting the heavy things. i just moved to a new area and don`t have any neighbors to help at all. try getting a cab of when it`s just you. :barf: you have to get a little inventive. :lol:

I'm in the middle of two frame off restorations. Both are currently stalled because my trucks are currently in another state (I moved, they haven't made it yet). My advice is to mentally prepare yourself. Pretty easy to get bored or burned out on a big project. That's how I ended up with two! Needed a change of scenery from the first and started a second. Don't recommend that!

Anyhow, I finally figured out a good philosophy. Looking at the project as a whole can tend to be overwhelming. There is a ton to do. More than likely twice the time and twice the money than you originally planned. I started breaking it out in my mind to a bunch of "mini projects". For instance, remove front clip might be one project. Once that is done, move onto the next, i.e. clean and prep frame for paint. Don't move onto another "project" until the previous one is complete. Write it all down and go step by step if you have to. Distractions can be a killer and sometimes it can be hard to get back on track.

Be ready to face some occasional frustration as well. Parts don't fit right, bought the wrong bolt, etc... A good idea to walk away and take a break. Always seems to work out once you're looking at it from a fresh perspective at a later time. Good luck.

Jason

Jason is absolutly right. Work on it a section at a time. One of the things that battles against you is that you have mapped out everything you want to do, and if you're like me have a pile of stuff that you have purchased stacked up in the corner waiting to be installed. Thats when you try to rush things to get to the final stage. My advice, finish every step before starting another. Win a lot of small victories, don't spread yourself too thin........Jerry

I suggest you get a factory assembly manual, and try to find good (repairable) sheet metal if possible. The after market stuff, such as fenders, doors don't seem to fit as well as factory original. Bamm 24's idea of baggies is also a very good idea. If I do another one, I will use aftermarket (Vintage Air) instead of messing with factory air.

I am working on the second and planning for the third. Remember even if you set a time limit, that you an walk away. One problem that I am experiencing this time round is the change in direction. I initially had said that this truck wold be a driver, but then started getting all original parts for the stock look, but this was/ is not the intended direction, so now I have a stock pile of original parts and am not going to use them. Know your direction and stick with it. If you get mad lay it down and do something else. Most of all stick to your budget if you can, I tend to get carried away and if it is used or looks bad I replace (not always good thing $$$$)

All good advice! My one year took me two,and I started with a truck in really good shape it more or less just needed freshened up. All I can really add is if you can get a dig. camera take alot of pics from alot of angles of anything you disassemble!!! Even the simple things seem to change shape and size after being in a box on a shelf for awhile!!! LOL. Plus you will enjoy looking back at what you had when you started. And so will we. Good Luck!!!

i am in the middle of mine and not geting along to well but. like was said you need the bags. and masking tape tools and such my air compressior just massed up and i have to get another one from some where. i am planing on having mine done in about 5 years and still dont know how i want it.

Frame off
 

if you are doing it yourself as I am trying to do,probably the best thing I did was get myself a 2 stage air compressor and the 970 bead blast cabinet from T.I.P products in canfield ohio Good Luck and as others have said at least twice the time you plan and if you are lucky only twice the money you were planning on spending

if there are two items such as inner fenders , door handles etc. if you buy one new you might as well buy The other cause the "good " ONE WILL LOOK LIKE CRAP. i RAN into this with inner fenders . Just my simple advice.

A camera is also invaluable for showing what piece went where, after 2 years you tend to forget what went where and how.
Ziplock bags for the bolts
Boxes to divide the project into smaller projects ie right front control arms (clean, paint, install shafts)

I restored just the chassis/suspension, and underside of the cab and bed, I did no bodywork except weld up some mirror holes in the door and it took me about 3-4 months of hard work by myself after work/school to completely disassemble, strip, paint, and put everything back together. If I was doing bodywork, I would probably still have it in the garage, lol.
Definitely label all bolts, I did this with mine. When I took them down to the hardware store to replace them all, and I knew what size and how many to get.

Somebody needs to put this thread on the FAQ page!

Again - Krue with a FAQ!! (How many times have I said that!!)

I agree with the ziplock bags and sharpie. I went that route one mine and it helped tremendously. I also took lots of pictures and it helped a bunch too. One thing that I haven't read yet (but kinda implied in a few replies) take the truck apart in sections. I removed bed, cab (with all guts) and front clip. Then I restored the entire chassis/suspension. Then when that was finished, I started the bed, cab and front clip. After 4 months at the body shop, I was amazed at how much I forgot where stuff went. The pictures and bags were invaluable.

Also, with this method, you have "stages" like some of the guys referred to. I was making awesome progress until the body went back on the chassis, then I got overwhelmed. I've finally got the dash and interior back in (well 80% of it) and now I'm focusing on the engine and engine compartment. If I don't focus on one section, I wind up spending 8 hours out in the garage just piddling from one thing to another and come back inside without anything accomplished.

Now, I have been keeping a log of the time spent on the project, and total cost. I plan on posting all of the info when I get a bit closer. I thought it would be cool to see how long this one took, and do another and how long that one takes... enough rambling for now..thanks for reading.

well, great info guys... that's why i love this board...but i guess i am going to be one of the lucky ones and not do this all by myself..i got some friends that work/run a bodyshop now and in a couple of months are going to start up thier own business with all areas of custom parts covered..body,paint,accessories,stereo..so i offered up my truck for a first project/advertisement vehicle..and they said yes...so, when the building gets finished and the tools get put in place, my truck will be the main focus of 4 guys 8-10 hours each day...(my truck will be thier job for a while) so i don't see this one even taking a year.. (but as everyone has said double the time) so we will see how this all pans out..i will take tons of pics and document as much as i can. I will let you guys know when tear down starts...

Thanks

Rick

Good advice all around. I am at the beginning of my project, the new frame is stripped clean sitting in the garage, got lots of parts on the way, but the main donor truck is still completely assembled.

Incoma makes a good point, one that has actually concerned me since starting my project, that is the upcoming cab stage. Moving it around will be tricky [intend to build a dolly], plus the large amount of work required with the wiring, replacing some floor etc. I expect the chassis assembly will be like the first month or so with a new girlfriend, you know, can't wait to get there and get busy. But then after a few months, it will be a little tougher to get out in the garage to sand another fender or grind out the box floor. Course if it was easy...

I am in the middle of mine as well! Rather than give a big long speech, I will just tell you the most important thing I have learned.

1. Zip Lock bags and Sharpies.
2. LOTS of storage space will be needed.
3. "Before" pictures ALWAYS help, especially during reassembly.
4. Don't throw anything away, you will more than likely need a piece off of it or need it for reference.
5. Have a plan of attack.
6. Don't skimp, always buy the best there is...even if it means it is more expensive. Buying cheaper parts or less-than-perfect parts will only come back to bite you.


Hope this helps a little, and I am sure you will learn your own secrets as you go. :)

With that many guys working on it as their actualy job, it will go pretty quickly, unless there are some real bad hidden problems that show up. Most people have to balance truck work with their main jobs, family, etc... A shop dedicated to a sole vehicle should have it looking great in no time. Care to post some pics as the work progresses? I would like to see it in different stages.

Man..I've got to tell you that all the advice above is right on. I'm in the middle of mine and it has been more than I originally thought. The first thing I can say is make sure your frame is good. After putting a lot of work into my original I finally tossed it and found another one. Mine was too far bent. I could see it was put in a frame straightener but with all the undercoating and grime I didn't know it at the time I bought it.
Second thing I've done is paid to have some work done that I did not want to do myself. Most of it was sandblasting and powdercoating. It's nice to take a dirty grimy piece and have it come back all clean and coated.
You are going to need space and lot's of it. I've just about got my chassis rolling and I'm now thinking about putting the chassis outside. Something I do not want to do but the cab is my next "project" and it's going to need some room.
Last item I can say is fit everything before paint. I can't tell you how much stuff you take for granted and then go to assemble and find a fit problem. I'm putting a diffenent motor and tranny in mine and have run into a few problems. None that couldn't have been fixed but you don't want to be drilling/cutting etc on a painted frame.

Okay here is my .02 cents. Speaking from a bodyman's perspective and currently being a bodyshop manager and all kinds of access to tools equipment and knowledge and the like. I would first make a game plan on what direction you want to go and stick with it as close as possible. WHILE YOU DRIVE THE TRUCK!!!!! Set up the engine you want, tranny, rear end, and suspension. Do not worry about painting or detailing anything yet. Do all of your gauges, wiring and such. Then get started on all of your bodywork. Align all of the panels first that you are going to use. Do any bodywork a panel at a time. Meanwhile you are driving this thing to shows, cruising it on the weekend because you do not care what it looks like because you are driving one cool 67-72 truck. Okay, bodywork is done, mechanicals are lined out. Blow this thing apart baby!!! Paint it all up and put it back together and then do your interior. Much easier, won't lose as much interest, won't lose as many parts and have fun while you are doing it. I have had my 72 2wd CST Blazer apart for 10 years and have about 18,000.00 dollars in it and NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING FINISHED. You get the point here. Trust me on this one.

Good point on driving while you restore it. Of course my truck is my daily driver so I don't really have a choice. :D

Make sure you plan out what you want as a finished product before you start. I am in the second year of the 6 month updating of my truck. I started my restore to be a daily driver and when I got into it I changed my direction (very bad idea) and now I am in deep and need to redo or settle for less than I believe I will be happy with. I did take pictures prior to disassembly, bought an assembly manual and a service manual and put the bolts in containers and bigger parts in seperate boxes. If you don't think you will be happy with something don't do it because you won't be happy!!!! I also took pictures of the early stages and put them above my work bench so I remember how far I have come, so I don't get discouraged with how far I have to go.

72CSTC5 Hit the nail on the head.

If I was to do it over again thats exacly the way I would approach mine. Another problem you face when doing everything at once is warranty. Because of the time involved you could easily end up shelling out $10-20K for drivetrain, suspension, and electrical parts and find that the warranty is expired before you ever get the wheels spinning. What do you think the dealer is going to say if you have to call them about a defective part you purchased 2-4 years ago but just used for the first time last week. That part could easily be an expensive item like an engine, tranny or rearend.

Replace, repair or modify a system. Then drive it, and work out all the bugs. Continue to repeat as required. When everything is just the way you want it.

Break it down and make it pretty.

Everything everyone has already said is EXCELLENT advice.

I would add only a copule of things.

1.) Have a plan before starting.
2.) Set timeline goals for yourself with the already mentioned "mini projects."

If you try to do "too much-too fast" you will more than likely be disappointed with the results. Take your time, yet set goals. Once you reach that goal, treat yourself. A new wrench ... a new part ... something small. This will help you to stay positive in your thinking and makes the job seem more like "fun" and not seem like a "job."

I will bet almost everyone here, at some point in their projects, have felt they are in way over their head. I know I sure have. What seemed like a mistake at first ended up being a learning experience. I have learned to tig weld, color sand/buff, and do some MAJOR fabrication that was way beyond my skills when I started. But the fact that I had ZERO bucks to pay someone else to do it forced me to learn to do it myself. What seemed like a "pain in the ass" turned into something that I wouldn't have learned otherwise. When you run up on these sort of obstacles, tTake a break for a day, or even a week, or two. You will be amazed how anxious you will be to get back to work once you are away from it for a little while.

BTW: I am in year 4 of a frame off ... that started as a two-weekend rocker and cab-corner replacement. :rolleyes:

Most important is to HAVE FUN! If it isn't fun, then it's a job.

AMEN!

I am to the point with my project that I am ready to reassemble (who cares if it is 15 different shades of paint and primer) and just DRIVE THE DAMN THING for a while and have some FUN! I am waaaaay beyond the giddy-excitement of getting a new part delivered by the UPS truck.

I just want to drive my truck and enjoy it!

Gawd, I wish I had read all of this before starting my project. This is really, really good stuff here.

What 72CSTC5 said has been the BEST advice I have read so far.

<rant off>

I don't know if anyone mentioned this, but the thing that hit me hardest when I was doing the frame up is the bodywork. I don't know if you plan to do your own, but if you do, you HAVE TO BE PATIENT. If you are not patient on your bodywork, it will come out looking like a golf ball with all of those dimples. If you plan to do the body work, read some books or talk to some professionals to get some ideas of techniques and where to start. Bodywork is the part of the project where I got to and started to think about selling my truck. In hindsight, I am very glad I didn't, but wish that I would have taken more time one bodywork and paint.

If I could say one thing, it would be this. Do it right the first time so you don't have to redo it. That is the biggest lesson I learned on the frame up on my truck.

Have fun and take your time.
Low68

I've done a few frame offs

Best tool I own?

A dry erase board and markers on the shop wall.

I always make lists. For instance a "need" list. Every time I need a special bolt, or can of paint, or whatever, I write it on the board.

Then, when I make a parts run, I get it all at one time and don't have to make wasted trips.

My board currently has 3 shopping lists on it:
1) Dealer parts needed
2) Chandlers parts needed (my local parts store)
3) Tractor supply stuff needed (they sell grade 8 hardware by the pound)

A lot of great advice by everyone! The only thing I will add is using pieces of cardboard to hold bolts. The baggies work great but there are time when you need certian bolts in certain holes. What I do is draw a picture of the part on the cardboard then punch holes for the bolts and put them in the holes. This works great for theings like water pump bolts or a/c brackets and anything else that has different size/length bolts holding it down.


Good Luck, Woody :b69:

Take lots of pics before and during the tear down it will help when it's time to put it back together....I know it sure helps me.

When I restored my corvette, I used a piece of styrofoam to thread allof th interior screws into and then painted all the heads black, as they were all the same size. When have unique parts, I usually bag em or attach them to a piece of cardboard and label them. Patience and good tools help a lot too!

I've finally come to the conclusion that my truck can't just have a few problems fixed. It needs new floor pans, rockers, cab corners, fenders, a better box, and I might be doing a cowl hood (more than likely, as its just a drop in the bucket with everything else it needs.....). So basically, I need to do a frame off as well. My question is, what does everyone like to use to clean up the frame? Is POR-15 and then a nice coat of gloss black paint the way to go, or is there another way that I haven't thought of? I figure rather than just do the body, interior and engine compartment and leave the underside looking bad, I might as well do it all right? Also, do you guys reccommend leaving the cab on, or just taking it off with everything else? I assume it is quite a bit more work to remove with the wiring harness and steering column and everything there.

Although you are having work done by someone else I will still share my advice
1. Stay organized in every part of this,money tools, time, parts
2. My son and I really wanted to save time and did not want to always have to work with dirty parts so we took it all apart Rented a large compressor( the kind that runs 2-3 jack hammers) sandblasted the entire frame and everything else we thought would be okay and then used the same compressor w/regulator to power spray gun to prime and paint just to keep things clean. Now we put new parts or good clean used parts together. Alot more enjoyable to work on.

Thats a good idea I have a daily driver and was thinking of doing my frame and suspension parts like this.

Did the rental compressor have a nozzle for sandblasting?
Where did you get the blasting material?
Can this be done under the truck, or did you need to take the clip, cab, bed, and engine/tras out?

The drive and restore method is a good idea. There is alot you can do before tearing it all apart. That way you can really take your time on everything you do. Your not under pressure to get it back together and you can spend money in small chunks. Also this will give you time to buy parts for the next step. Planning is the key. Mine has rust underheath. To me it seems to make more sense to attack that first since it gets worse pretty quick once it gets to a certain point. What good is a truck with a new drive train that is rusted away? From my experience the body work is where most of the money is anyway and it can be done in parts. Once the vehicle's foundation is secure, go to the interior. Alot can be done there and it will be rewarding because your really notice changes to the interior. Do mechanical systems last and split them up into areas like, engine, transmission, suspension, electrical, exhaust, etc. Finally pull the engine and redo the mechanicals and while its out the engine compartment. Thats what my plan is at least. Having a plan to start with is the most important part.

What ever way you decide to go, don't go "The I remember route"..

ASK IT LOOKS WORST WHEN ITS WRONG.

My 8 month frame off.
 

I am on the 7th month of my 8 month frame off restoration. I just decided that I am not going to try and get it done this summer. Problem is mostly time. I was so pushed to get it done that I have been working on it alot. This resulted in it being more of a job and less fun. I decided to make it more fun and slow down a bit. It is a good time to have a hot rod to work on when you get some free time. I realized that once I get the truck done, I won't have anything to work on anymore.

Currently my truck has a box, cab, fenders, motor, tranny, posi and smoothy tires. I had the frame sand blasted, added all new supension, and painted it with "Chassis Saver", new brakes, air, radiator, built 400 hp 383, TH400, 3.43 posi, ect.

Here are a few pointers that I have learned:

1) Chassis Saver is an excellent product.
2) When stumped, go to the board, someone else has already been down your road.
3) It is nice to have several trucks around. I have three. My black CST which I bought when I was 17, the Arizona truck which I looked for forever and is now stripped, and a rusty camper special which was really stock and complete. When putting my truck back together, the camper special proved valuable to look at, steal screws and bolts, and all around extra parts.
4) Ziploc bags are a must
5) Take pictures, they will be handy later

Have Fun

Jason

Somehow missed this thread. Will ad my .02. everyone has covered the "before" documentation. I would like to say the "during documentation" is just as important.

This is primarily directed at the guys that modify their trucks (sorry CPNE). Examples of this are for brake swaps, suspension mods, ANY electrical change. If you added on disc brakes it would be a wise idea to document every changed component for future referance when you or the next owner needs to replace something.

Go ballistic with it too. Document part name, part#, year make and model of donor vehicle. If aftermarket: vendor name, vendor part#. On my wiring changes, I have printed out the wiring diagrams and penned in the deletions, additions and modifications. Try to keep the data on the component mod all-encompassing. There's an amazing amount of do-dads ya gotta keep track of. Like on fans: temp switches, wire gauges, fuse locations, relays...

Keep all of this along with the manufacturers literature in an indexed 3 ring binder and keep it beside your shop manual. As a fail-safe (k so I'm anal about some things) I have written in the preface of each chapter of my shop manual a brief reminder of what has been modded.

Have yet to do a frame off. Mine has been a running daily driver since 3 months after I bought it. Been 2+ years now and it is almost, well allmost allmost done.