Make it handle

[bnelson]

Whew, that was a lot of reading, but I feel like I've gotten a great education on suspension. Rob or Nate (or anyone else who has some input), what do you think about using stock car style weight jack buckets for the rear springs (not my idea, found it on this site). Seems like a cheap way to get a couple extra inches of drop while keeping the spring taller and preserving more travel, plus it's adjustable. Is there any downside to using something like this?

[robnolimit]

When compared to a short spring, this is a better choice. I'm in favor of longer, softer springs that require more static spring compression at ride height. Weight jacks (threaded spring adjusters) can also be added to allow fine tuning of ride height and weight balance. I say go for it.

[Conundrum]

I've been away for quite sometime. Is leaning the spindle 1-1/4" still a good idea or has there been a change in the amount? I'm wanting to get back on the front suspension of my 74 GMC.

[robnolimit]

The 1 1/4" offset, from the lower to the upper ball joint, is still a goos number. we usually move the lower forward 1", and then modify the upper to get the last part.

[Conundrum]

Thank you for the reply Rob

I have already centered my wheels when I did the Z, so I figure i'll do 5/8" forward on the lowers and 5/8" reward on the uppers so that they stay centered.

Does anything need to be done as far as ball joint angle is concerned?

[robnolimit]

Ball joints are fine. Sounds like your on the right track.

[robnolimit]

Catch the airing of the Optima OUSCI qualifier thursday, oct 31, yes, on candy day, on Mav TV. A few fast trucks made the grade here.

[jayman68]

About track width testing:

You found the best results with the front track width 1/2" wider than the rear.
To adjust the track width on the front would we change the length of the A-arms? Is as wide as you can get better or is there a point where it gets too wide? How does your wide ride I.F.S. kit change front width, and how much? To adjust the rear the options would be change the axle length, change back spacing, or spacers, did I miss any?
Is there an advantage to having the tire width(front) centered on the turn pivot point? (Where would that point be?) Or would it be better adjusted out or in? That would change with back spacing.
Does the tread width have any effect?
Is the point of tire width to get more rubber on the ground for traction, or does it affect the handling? i.e. if the track width is the same, just a wider tire.
Thanks for your time and input.

[rin68]

What time? Did not see it on the schedule

[robnolimit]

I'm not sure, it was on Optima's mailing list. I'll try to find out

[Custom 68]

Here is what I got.

Premiere of OPTIMA’s Search for the Ultimate Street Car: Faceoff at Road America Qualifier Event to Air on MAV TV Network
OPTIMA’s Faceoff at Road America Qualifying Event Episode Premieres Thursday, October 31 with more high intensity performance vehicles and nail-biting action

Oct. 17, 2012 (MILWAUKEE) – OPTIMA® Batteries, the global leader in high-performance automotive and marine AGM batteries and chargers, is proud to announce the premiere of the OPTIMA’s Search for the Ultimate Street Car series to air on Thursday, October 31 at 6 p.m. EDT and 9 p.m. EDT on MAV TV.

In the premiere, viewers will get a behind-the-scenes look at the action during the OPTIMA Faceoff at Road America in Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin. This regional qualifying event introduces a diverse range of performance vehicles and thestories behind the passionate drivers as they compete on one of the most historic race tracks in America.

“This episode captures the passion of the automotive community with a great cast of entertaining characters. If you’re looking for fast beautiful cars, then this is your show,” said Cam Douglass director of product development and marketing for OPTIMA Batteries. “This series has grown so much over the past few years – many thanks to our sponsors and loyal enthusiasts – and we look forward to sharing the excitement of OPTIMA’s Faceoff at Road America Qualifying Event with viewers at home.”

The fun begins as all of the Faceoff participants drive more than 60 miles through Wisconsin’s scenic Kettle Moraine State Park to the Road America facility in the Detroit Speed Road Rally. Later in the weekend, all 71 Faceoff participants get on the track to test their cars and driving skills through the BFGoodrich Hot Lap Challenge, Wilwood Disc Brakes Speed Stop Challenge, Ridetech Street Challenge Autocross and the Lingenfelter Performance Engineering Design Challenge.

Participants traveled from all over the country to showcase their vehicle’s performance potential - making this year the most diverse yet. During the episode, fourparticipants are awarded with invitations to OPTIMA’s Ultimate Street Car Invitational event, held after the SEMA show in Pahrump, NV. Viewers can watch (and Tweet along using the hashtag #OUSCI) to see which participants are selected based not only on their vehicle’s performance, but also the spirit and attitude they showed over the course of the weekend.
Get in on the Action

The Faceoff at Road America is a Regional Qualifier event leading up to OPTIMA’s Ultimate Street Car Invitational, to be held in Pahrump, NV, after the SEMAshow in early November. Fans can purchase tickets to the sixth annual OPTIMA Ultimate Street Car Invitational at http://optimainvitational.com/. Tickets are $30 per person and include a free event t-shirt. The event will take place at Spring Mountain Motor Resort and Country Club, a state-of-the-art racing facility in Pahrump, Nevada on Saturday, November 9, 2013.
The OPTIMA Ultimate Street Car Invitational is presented by Royal Purple Synthetic Oil and K&N Filters. This year’s event sponsors are BFGoodrich Tires, Detroit Speed and Engineering, Lingenfelter Performance Engineering, Ridetech and Wilwood Disc Brakes. And finally, associate sponsors include Magnaflow Performance Exhaust, The Roadster Shop, Centerforce Performance Clutch, MAC Tools and Jet-Hot Coatings.

For more information on the OPTIMA Ultimate Street Car Invitational, please visit http://www.optimainvitational.com/.

[Custom 68]

It will be on my DVR for sure...

[laid67]

Hey all, Rob, Many of us make modifications to, or buy custom cross members/control arms to move our front wheels forward, and center them in the wheel arches. Why not take it farther and move the front cross member and everything attached forward a few more inches? I have seen elsewhere on truck handling projects but never on a C10. I understand we already have a pretty long, in some cases not so desirable wheelbase., but it seems like there would be something to gain from it though with weight distribution. A front-mid engined truck might even be possible. I always wondered with hellboy why you guys didn't move the front wheels forward some since you were already doing custom fenders and frame.

I forget which TV show I saw it on, but some guys took a 93 ford ranger and moved the front suspension forward 3 or 4 inches and reworked the fenders to fit. It came out great and handled well.

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by laid67

Hey all, Rob, Many of us make modifications to, or buy custom cross members/control arms to move our front wheels forward, and center them in the wheel arches. Why not take it farther and move the front cross member and everything attached forward a few more inches? I have seen elsewhere on truck handling projects but never on a C10. I understand we already have a pretty long, in some cases not so desirable wheelbase., but it seems like there would be something to gain from it though with weight distribution. A front-mid engined truck might even be possible. I always wondered with hellboy why you guys didn't move the front wheels forward some since you were already doing custom fenders and frame.

I forget which TV show I saw it on, but some guys took a 93 ford ranger and moved the front suspension forward 3 or 4 inches and reworked the fenders to fit. It came out great and handled well.

There are two reasons for something like this. 1) Weight balance. Moving the front CL forward effectively moves the balance point back. 2) Wheel Base. A longer wheel base may help stability at higher speeds. Bonneville streamliners are well over 350 inches now, very stable in a straight line, but doesn't corner too well. A Smart car with it's 72" (whatever) wheelbase will turn around in it's own shadow, but I don't want to be in one at 90 mph - or really at all. Camaros are 106", Chevelles and Novas 108" to 112". So, you pick the situation. Our old chevies are around 114" - already long enough for me. - My red C10 is a bit shorter at 107".

[INSIDIOUS '86]

I have a question here. If I moved my instant center up with my front spring hanger relocated and dropped my leaf on the shackle in the rear this will give more traction upon launching in a straight line. I'm wondering how this wil also effect cornering. I'm assuming I will get more bite coming out of a corner correct?

Also I'm fabbing my own track bar for the rear does it matter which side mounts to the frame or axle much?

[robnolimit]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

I have a question here. If I moved my instant center up with my front spring hanger relocated and dropped my leaf on the shackle in the rear this will give more traction upon launching in a straight line. I'm wondering how this wil also effect cornering. I'm assuming I will get more bite coming out of a corner correct?

Also I'm fabbing my own track bar for the rear does it matter which side mounts to the frame or axle much?

The spring mount idea is spot on. As for the track bar, while there may be some difference on mounting if you tip the bar, for street guys it will be level, so it doesn't really matter.

[derrickmanx1]

I just ordered my rack and pinion. I can't wait to get it going.

[robnolimit]

Thanks Derrick

[jimmydean]

Rob, just wanted to say congrats on another Goodguys Pro Class title. Hellboy is such a sick truck, you have proven you know what you are doing on this subject.

[68GMCCustom]

Originally Posted by jimmydean

Rob, just wanted to say congrats on another Goodguys Pro Class title. Hellboy is such a sick truck, you have proven you know what you are doing on this subject.

...and don't forget he's driving it too! Mans got some skillz!

[SIETEDOCE]

i have a idea, what do you think

[SIETEDOCE]

good or bad idea?

[mac808]

Haha! Thats a neat idea!

[CSGAS]

Scietedoce, you might like looking at the adjustable control arms listed in the racer's section of the Speedway Motors site. You could also make up the legs of your control arms from adjustable rod ends and one of the ball joint retainers they have. I could spend more money than I ever earned over there on neat suspension stuff, easily :-D

[theastronaut]

Does the taller C20 ball joint work for all year C10 trucks (63-87)? I have a pair of CPP modular spindles for a 73-87 and wanted to make sure this would work before I bought ball joints for it. They're going on a '66 C10.