The Story Of A Cummins Suburban (Lots Of Pics)

[justcuz]

Hey Mosesburb, what is your rear pinion angle set at? Do you think you may have a rear u-joint bind? Its hard to tell from the pictures but it looks kind of steep to me. Just a guess.

Love the completed pictures and the photos of the trip.

You running 4.10's?
You just went from about a 29 or 30 inch tire to about 33's right? I bet your mileage will improve some.
A .73 5th gear would give you 3.00's from the 4.10. It seems like you should be in the ballpark now. Plus the increase of tire diameter should net you a tick lower numerically.

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by justcuz

Hey Mosesburb, what is your rear pinion angle set at? The u-joint angle is about 13.5deg. It is less than the fifteen practical maximum, but more than I would like. The front and rear u-joint angles are within one degree of each other. Do you think you may have a rear u-joint bind? No, not even close. Its hard to tell from the pictures but it looks kind of steep to me. It is. It is greater than the maximum manufacturer recommended angle, but less than the practical maximum.Just a guess.

Love the completed pictures and the photos of the trip. Thanks!!

You running 4.10's? Yes, still have 4.10s
You just went from about a 29 or 30 inch tire to about 33's right? I bet your mileage will improve some. Actually it was about 32" to a 33" tire, so not too much difference.
A .73 5th gear would give you 3.00's from the 4.10. It seems like you should be in the ballpark now. Plus the increase of tire diameter should net you a tick lower numerically.

...

[mosesburb]

I had a lingering doubt about the rear axle because I had never driven the truck that it came out of. I doubted that there was a problem in it, but for two reasons I purchased a complete 14FF assembly out of a you pull it yard. The first reason was I wanted to try a complete axle assembly--untouched--and see if anything changed with the vibration and second (more importantly) was I wanted to go with a higher gear ratio--3.73 as the 4.10's are just too much gear for a torque motor. They are fine for a small block, but running them with the Cummins was a chore as the motor wound up too quickly and spun too fast on the highway.

I finally got fed up one day and went shopping. One yard--nothing, second yard had one that could have been something, but the SPID label was gone and I did not feel like pulling a diff cover in a mud puddle, so I passed. The third yard had what ended up being the cat's ass. I found a super-clean '97 G3500 passenger van. I checked the SPID label and found the GT4 code indicating the desired 3.73 ratio. I pulled it out and loaded it onto one of the wagons tha they provide and dragged it about 1/8-1/4 mile to the cashier. I left it outside as it had completely kicked my ass dragging it across the yard on two flat tires and it not being light to begin with. The cashier made me bring it inside. I stated that it is what it looks like and it looks the same out there as it would in here, but she still made me drag it inside (thank you nice lady). I paid my money, loaded it in the truck and headed home and unloaded it.

As a side note, I had looked at the van that this came from and I wondered why a truck this clean was in the wrecking yard. It had no insurance company information on it, but then I found the "c4c" on it. Ahhhh, the wonderful Cash For Clunkers program. Well, I cut the SPID label off of it and when I got home I ran the vin on the state website to see how many miles it had on it when it was last emission tested--and also how bad it was polluting. I found that it had 157,000 on it and it ran so clean it practically made air. Yeah, great truck to take off the road guys.

So, I wanted to put this diff in without touching anything. I only had one problem and that was the parking brake cables were the later design that I had initially wanted, but couldn't find. Now I had them, but I had already set the truck up to use the older bolt-in style. Now, I could redo the truck and use the newer cables, but I did not feel like doing all of that to swap out a diff. I happened to have a set of one ton (13x3.5") backing plates that use the bolt in parking brake cables. I swapped those on with all of the late model brake components that came on the axle. One sweet bonus of this swap is I get slide-off brake drums!!! Woo-hoo!! I did have to pull the hubs to swap the backing plates though, but when I did I checked out the bearings and they look great. The gear oil smelled good. I got a unit that is in great shape.

I cut the perches off and welded them in the correct place. Before I swapped the new axle in I took my 2.5 deg angle milled Zero Rates and turned them around thus raising the existing pinion five degrees. That made no change at all. I got home and pulled the diff and swapped in the new one. While I was taking it apart one nut on one of the new u-bolts galled. Nobody in town stocks them and spring shops are closed, but a couple phone calls later to some fellow gear heads had a replacement located and the project back in motion.

I got the new diff in and bled the brakes and went for a drive. The first thing I noticed is how nice the truck drives with the higher gears. I can drive around without having to use fifth gear. Prior to the swap, my maximum speed in fourth gear (1:1) was 55mph. I had to be in fifth to merge onto the freeway. Now, my top speed in fourth is about 65mph. It doesn't seem like much, but it make a huge difference in drivability. It spins slower on the freeway such that it quiets the motor down significantly. The motor lays down above 90mph now instead of 82mph. All in all it wa worth every bit of effort to install. I can not convey how much nicer this thing is to drive now that the motor spins slower. The fatigue factor of a roadtrip will be lessened significantly.

It has the cool, ribbed-for-her-pleasure housing:




So, it drives soooo nice now, the vibration...


















oh yeah.....





























remains alive and well!! No difference whatsoever!!

Argh. I guess I knew it going in, but I really hoped it would take care of it.

[mosesburb]

Soooo, what to do now. I decided to compose a couple emails and send them to people who have more experience in this arena than I do. I wrote a couple emails that looked like novels and sent one to Dan at quad4x4. I have had great luck with everything that I have purchased from him but more importantly, I have never been able to stump him with any question I have asked of him. He responded back with some quality information and helpful suggestions. I checked a few of the things out and while I was doing that I got a response from my second email that I had sent to Jess at High Angle Driveline.

Jess' response was basically one sentance stating that he knew what my problem was and that I needed his patented drive flange and a double cardan shaft. He guaranteed that this would solve my problem and while I have no reason to doubt the master, I still wondered why. I gave him a call and he spent a fair bit of time on the phone with me explaining the situation. He said that the problem I am having is called gear rattle. It occurs when the joints operate over eight degress and they create a oscillation in the shaft and the shaft will push the oscillation out into the transfer case or into the ring and pinion. I had not told anybody that the vibration under decel sounded like the ring and pinion was coming apart, but he told me that it was--I was very impressed.

Anyways, I ordered up a 1350 series double cardan shaft assembly and a a week or so later a box showed up. Inside the box was one of these:







I had to change the pinion angle that I had just installed, so out came the new diff. I decided to get new perches so I wouldn't have to cut these off again and re-re-weld them on. I got the new perches tacked on and the axle temporarily re-installed. I installed the output flange on the transfer case and installed the driveshaft. I finalized the pinion angle two degrees down from the driveshaft and welded the perches on and installed new u-bolts. I got the shocks re-installed and hooked the brake lines back up. It was time to go to work and I knew there was no way I was going to be able to get work done efficiently thinking about this thing sitting at home in the driveway, so I decided to take it on a test drive to work--all or nothing.

So I did a quick transfer of all my rain gear from my S10 back into the Suburban (it wasn't needed, but if I didn't have it, it would have poured), grabbed my lunch and jumped in. Now, from the get-go, the biggest pain of the vibration has been that it occurs at 60mph and higher. That means that no matter what I try I have to drive it atleast 60mph. Now, the only place nearby to drive that fast is the freeway and there is no getting on slowly or taking your time getting up to speed. With that in mind, I get on the freeway as gingerly as possible. I get up to speed and merge on and all seems well. I play around in the range that I think it should be in (at this point I have not gotten my speedometer recalibrated for the 3.73's) and all seems well. I get to work and am fairly pleased and I believe the vibration is gone, but I want to be sure so I reserve judgement until the ride home.

I get out of work and and quite anxious to drive the truck for some reason. I get on the freeway and all seems well. I roll into and out of the throttle and it seems good. I run it way past where the vibration should have been and all is good. Then I run it way up and let off abruptly and it coasts down smoooothly and quietly--all is good--life is good!!

Yessir, all it took was a gold-plated driveshaft to fix the problem. Now, there is nothing wrong with my previous driveshaft--nothing at all. It just happens that he length, diameter, angle and any other variable added up against me to create an issue. I have seen drivelines with much more angle run smooth as can be--why did I have a problem?? Basically it came down to bad luck. An identical truck might not have ever had an issue while mine did. One Blazer with a driveline that practically hangs straight down has no isssues while the same setup in an identical Blazer vibrates like all get out--luck of the draw.

So me and my boy head out for an extended test drive. We head about fifty miles east to an antique tractor show and the whole drive is absolutely wonderful. Worth every penny of driveline and 3.73s. It is so nice to drive now.

So the vibration is gone and all is well right?? Well, sort of. I developed a new vibration. Are you getting tired of vibrations?? I sure am.

Near the end of our journey back (on our way to our second destination of the day--still on a freeway) I picked up a horrible grinding type very deep vibration. WTH now?!? I tried a few things to see if it affected the situation at all. I tried accelereation, braking, swerve right, swerve left and nothing affects it. The wierd thing about this vibration is it is intermittent--yes it comes and goes. After driving for a couple miles while trying to get on the other side of a mountain to where a good friend lives, the vibration stops--smooth sailing. Huh?? Gone?? Yup, gone. How, why, what...?? I hit a bump--an expansion joint at the leading edge of a bridge--and it is back in full force. Huh?? How?? Then I hit the expansion joint at the far side of the bridge and it is gone--just like that--GONE!! Huh?? How?? It basically repeats this scenario over every bridge/overpass. No worries as there are no mile long bridges or anything, but the problem comes in a single bump that has no partner. The bump kicks in the vibration, but there is no second bump to "turn it off".

Anyways, I get to where I am going and on the way home on surface streets I get no vibration at all. Is all well?? No. On my way home from work (not to work, but from work) just before I get to my exit, just after hitting a bump it is back in full force. Swell. Same thing the next day, but it came back about a mile sooner, but not enough to diagnose it. Hit one bump and it is on, hit another bump and it is gone. Now I am to the point I do not want ot drive this thing on the freeway or any distance far from home for fear of this thing going crazy, but I have to drive it 10-12 miles to get the vibration to occur.

So, here I am. Everything works fantastic--except whatever is causing the current vibration. I checked my mileage for about 175mi of driving--some highway and some city with a corrected speedometer and netted 19.55mpg without trying--just driving normal. So, with that, I am pleased. I hope to pass twenty soon, but we'll see.

Any guesses on the latest and greatest vibration?? The winner will get a cool prize!!

[justcuz]

Wow! I would start at the front and work your way back tightening all the driveline mounting bolts and look and see if there is an obvious rub somewhere. It seems weird that it changes with a bump. I'm going out on a limb here but do you think the previous harmonic may have loosened the 5th gear bolt in the transmission? Maybe a u-joint needs more grease. Maybe the adapter housing from the trans to t-case came loose or adapter to t-case. The last thing would be the throwout bearing maybe? It is hard to think of stuff. (I am trying to visualize in my mind your running gear). Is it directly related to vehicle speed or powertrain speed. If it happens again and you can safely do it, I would depress the clutch and throw it in neutral and see if it is isolated to the driveline or the engine. I had a input bearing crap out on a transmission once because the bell housing was not perfectly centered. The bell housing had been on a truck for years with no wear to the trans, but when I put the same engine and bellhousing in a passenger car with a Saginaw 4 speed the input bearing crapped out. I did remove the bell housing to clean it and reinstalled it, not checking the runout. My point is I ended up with a little rumble I could not figure out untill the transmission started shifting hard. Then I figured the bearings were getting loose. I have no idea what is happening but I hope you find it. This must be driving you nuts by now.

[jbclassix]

Here is how I figured out what was vibrating in my Yukon. I drove it. And drove it, and drove it, and drove it... and then the problem shot through the diff cover. Hey! I found it!

Probably not the best troubleshooting method.

on a serious note... bring the truck up to operating temperature and check the exhaust for contact or miss-aligned hagers when expanded.

just one suggestion for now

[northburb]

Just found this thread. what a nice build... there must be something with some of these old burbs, I have been fighting a vibration ( or gremlin as I like to call it ) as well and can't seem to make it go away, However, after reading that yours was gone for a short time after replacing the driveline, I guess thats the only logical next step for me. keep posting, I'm definately keeping tuned in to see how this turns out.

here's mine from December
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=375291

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by justcuz

Wow! I would start at the front and work your way back tightening all the driveline mounting bolts and look and see if there is an obvious rub somewhere. It seems weird that it changes with a bump. I'm going out on a limb here but do you think the previous harmonic may have loosened the 5th gear bolt in the transmission? No Maybe a u-joint needs more grease. No, but you are kind of close Maybe the adapter housing from the trans to t-case came loose or adapter to t-case. No adapter housing--case bolts to the trans. The last thing would be the throwout bearing maybe? No It is hard to think of stuff. You're telling me....(I am trying to visualize in my mind your running gear). Is it directly related to vehicle speed or powertrain speed. Ground speed, not engine speed If it happens again and you can safely do it, I would depress the clutch and throw it in neutral and see if it is isolated to the driveline or the engine. I did this, but I forgot to mention it. No change--of course I have no idea what is happening but I hope you find it. Thanks. This must be driving you nuts by now. Actually, I'm kind of getting used to vibrations now, but yes, I do want it gone..

Originally Posted by jbclassix

Here is how I figured out what was vibrating in my Yukon. I drove it. And drove it, and drove it, and drove it... and then the problem shot through the diff cover. Hey! I found it!

Probably not the best troubleshooting method.

Maybe not, but to be completely honest, I was actually hoping for a solution like that with the first vibration.

Originally Posted by northburb

Just found this thread. what a nice build...

Thanks!!

Originally Posted by northburb

there must be something with some of these old burbs, I have been fighting a vibration ( or gremlin as I like to call it ) as well and can't seem to make it go away, However, after reading that yours was gone for a short time after replacing the driveline, I guess thats the only logical next step for me. keep posting, I'm definately keeping tuned in to see how this turns out.

Your symptoms sound very familiar, very familiar.

On a completely unrelated note, I did figure out what was the cause of the "new" vibration. By doing the vehicle gyrations while the vibration was occurring, I had eliminated many possibilities. One thing that had stuck in my mind was when I went to the speedometer shop, they ran it on the dyno which is right outside a window from the waiting room. Now, my rear driveline vibration is gone, but I was still wondering if the pinion was moving up and down, so I would look out the window while it was being run on the dyno. The pinion was not moving mych at all, but one thing I did notice is that the front driveshaft was windmilling and that the source of the windmilling was from the transfer case, not the front axle as it was stationary during the test.

Knowing this, I decided that my latest and greatest vibration had something to do with this. One day before work, I pulled the driveshaft off of the front pinon and knocked the slip joint apart and lo-and-behold it was quite dry. I had greased the zerk when I put it in until grease came out the hole in the yoke and called it good. Well, what happened was the grease I installed got pumped down one spline and into the void at the end of the yoke, then got pumped out the hole in the end of the yoke bit by bit over every bump I hit, leaving the rest of the splines with a very minimal amount of lube.

So, I manually packed some grease into the splines of the yoke and also the splines on the shaft, put it back together and drove it to work. Everything was cool--because it would only do it on the way home. The drive home was uneventful. Did I fix it or is it going to come back tomorrow?? Well, last week I put about 325mi on it with enough sustained highway driving to be able to say that the latest and greatest vibration is gone. Yay!!

So, at this vibration-free point in time, I have made some observations. The first is that the 3.73 swap was worth every penny and hour of time invested. My engine speed at 65mph is a just fuzz under 1800rpm, which makes the motor so much quieter it becomes a background noise as opposed to front and center as it was before. Now, that being said, it was not that bad before, but it is just so much nicer now. I am very glad that I did it. The second observation is since the 3.73 swap, I have not had a tank of fuel burn at a rate less than 19.15mpg. The verdict is still out, but it appears that the swap netted me 1-1.5 mpg. A nice side bonus of the swap. I have a feeling that this is pretty accurate because the last tank of fuel was not shown any mercy. Now, I did not beat on it, but I did leave a "black cloud calling card" here and there. Prior to the swap, I would have expected this tank to burn at about 17 to maaaaybe 17.5 if I was lucky.

So, I guess I need to figure out why my front shaft is windmilling. I guess it is not so important now that the shaft is greased, but it still makes me wonder because I can grab the shaft and spin it with no resistance, no dragging, no noise etc.

Oh, one last observation: This truck sounds pretty damn serious running 65mph on the dyno right outside a thin piece of glass in a small waiting room that happens to be completely reverberating to the tune of the Cummins 5.9th overture. That was almost worth the price of the speedometer recalibration right there.

[LOW DOUGH]

[justcuz]

I used to see that on a lot of early F-250's. The front driveshaft would be slowly rotating driving down the road...at a speed that was not directly related to wheel speed. There is only one guess I have on this happening and that is the circulation of oil in the transfer case has a parasitic effect on the front output gear and spins it slowly. The oil is the wind and the front output gear is the blade of the windmill. If you had a clunk hitting bumps I would have guessed slip yoke right away. I found out about greasing output splines on slip yoke when I had that clunking on the Blazer. Transmission shop guy clued me in to it.

I am slowly learning a little about diesels, when you leave the black signature when you accelerate does that mean you can up you turbo boost pressure a little, or is the black just momentary? The Cummins from my research seems to be the most cost effective diesel from a reliability and ease of modification standpoint for light duty trucks. Seems like you made a good engine choice.

Its amazing how just a roughly 10% reduction in engine speed can make such a difference in the way the truck runs. Basically if you ran 35 inch tires the 4.10 would have been fine then. Reason I ask is I am thinking of building a diesel off roader in the future and plan on roughly 35 inch tires with a 4" lift and some fender trimming. Its gonna be a square body Suburban or longbed pickup with a shell.

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by LOW DOUGH

Originally Posted by justcuz

I used to see that on a lot of early F-250's. The front driveshaft would be slowly rotating driving down the road...at a speed that was not directly related to wheel speed. Yeah, the old High-Boys with the six foot long front shaft. There is only one guess I have on this happening and that is the circulation of oil in the transfer case has a parasitic effect on the front output gear and spins it slowly. The oil is the wind and the front output gear is the blade of the windmill. If you had a clunk hitting bumps I would have guessed slip yoke right away. Nope, no noise whatsoever I found out about greasing output splines on slip yoke when I had that clunking on the Blazer. Transmission shop guy clued me in to it. The High Angle Driveline that I got was completely packed with grease, but the front shaft I had lengthened by my driveline guy was returned dry. I thought filling the zerk would do it--wrong (obviously). I wish I would have known that it wouldn't work prior as it took a bazillion pumps to fill the void in the end of the yoke.

I am slowly learning a little about diesels, when you leave the black signature when you accelerate does that mean you can up you turbo boost pressure a little, or is the black just momentary? Yeah, boost can be added. What the smoke is is too much fuel. Mine is not bad. It pumps a bit out under heavy acceleration at low speed, but is almost non-existent on the freeway under heavy throttle. Excessive fuel in a diesel nets high exhaust gas temperatures (EGT) which will kill a motor quick if allowed to get out of hand. The Cummins from my research seems to be the most cost effective diesel from a reliability and ease of modification standpoint for light duty trucks. They are plentiful because they came in Dodges and the motor will typically outlast several Dodge bodies, so they are plentiful in classifieds and wrecking yards. They also have tremendous aftermarket support which makes modifications simple. Their factory parts availability is good also as these motors came in damn near everything--big trucks (Freightliner, Peterbilt, International), farm equipment (Ford, Case IH, etc), Indutrial equipment (the "B" series Cummins was developed for Case equipment). All of this makes parts readily available at many different locations. Seems like you made a good engine choice. I hope so as I really don't want to re-do it.

Its amazing how just a roughly 10% reduction in engine speed can make such a difference in the way the truck runs. Basically if you ran 35 inch tires the 4.10 would have been fine then. Reason I ask is I am thinking of building a diesel off roader in the future and plan on roughly 35 inch tires with a 4" lift and some fender trimming. Its gonna be a square body Suburban or longbed pickup with a shell.

If you would have told me about the difference I would experience from a slight gear change I probably would not have believed it.

[BLACK AND BLUE 67-72]

Awesome job!!!

[MrBeast]

Man every time I look at that thing, its just well, cool. If gm built what you have today, well they wouldnt be going broke, cause I know id buy one.

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by BLACK AND BLUE 67-72

Awesome job!!!

Thank you!!

Originally Posted by MrBeast

Man every time I look at that thing, its just well, cool.

Thanks!!

Originally Posted by MrBeast

If gm built what you have today, well they wouldnt be going broke, cause I know id buy one.

Yeah, if nothing else, they would have gone down swinging.

Well, I passed 6000mi on the way home from work today. The only notable issues so far have been the injection pump seal that failed, the radiator situation and the rear driveline vibration. Other than those, it has been smooth sailing considering all that was done to it.
Oh, it is still fun to drive.

[MrBeast]

I am glad to see, you are enjoying it, In a couple weeks once I have got my new garage door cut into the new shop the 85 will be going in to start on its conversion.

I was going to ask, did you rebuild the NV4500 yourself?

[MrBeast]

I have a good question for you, I have heard that the stock GM master cylinder is not sufficiant to push the dodge slave on the cummins, I am looking at a wilwood that has a 1" bore and 1" stroke, do you think that would be sufficiant?

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by MrBeast

I was going to ask, did you rebuild the NV4500 yourself?

Yes, there is a pic or two in here somewhere.

Originally Posted by MrBeast

I have a good question for you, I have heard that the stock GM master cylinder is not sufficiant to push the dodge slave on the cummins, I am looking at a wilwood that has a 1" bore and 1" stroke, do you think that would be sufficiant?

I honestly do not know. I have a complete hydraulic system for a 1st gen Dodge in mine. Might be something to consider for simplicity and ease of adapting.

Speaking of adapting, how are you adapting your 4500 to the 1st gen plate on the back of the motor?? Did you get the '94up motor plate with the trans?? If not you will need a conversion bellhousing to mate the 4500 to a 1st gen plate and at that point I would highly suggest the 1st gen hydraulic setup.

[mosesburb]

Well, I haven't been doing much with this except driving it. A couple notable things have occurred with it lately though. First and foremost, the moment you all have been waiting for (well, I have anyways), I got this super-lightweight, super-aerodynamic machine over 20mpg!! Yessir, we got a 20.55mpg tank out of it. I'm not sure how it happened, but I did the math three times and it worked out the same each time. Of course the next tank was 16.83 (I have no idea whatsoever how THAT happened), but that was followed my a 19.95, so I am counting the 16.83 as an anomaly. All along, I was hoping to get over 20mpg with this 6600lb machine and I finally got it. Hopefully I can repeat it here soon. Ironically, that 20.55 had some stop and go, some extended idle time and some A/C time on it as well (this time of year, the only time the A/C is on is when my wife is in the truck).

I finally got around to regearing the front axle. I picked up a set of like-new, used 3.73 gears. I then managed to match schedules with an old friend of mine to help with the install--thanks Brooce!! Everything to do with the gears went as smooth as could be, but I had some issues with water in the hubs. I am not sure how it got in as all of the seals and the washers under the screws are new, but there was definitely water in there at some time. Upon removal of the locking hub, I was greeted with rust everywhere. The left side was worse than the right as it required replacement of the outer wheel bearing and race due to rust issues. Immediately on the inside of the bearing was perfect--no water got past the bearing. On the right side, no water even got to the bearing. I only had to clean up the mess in the splined area of the hub. I will have to do some more looking to see how the water got in as it could only come from rain and/or driving in rain as the front axle has not been submerged in water.

On a completely different note, some of you may remember when I built the exhaust for this I built one section of it twice--one section with a muffler and the same section without a muffler. Well, Saturday morning I swapped the muffler-less pipe into the truck. Wow, what a difference. There is not too much noise difference idling and driving with a light foot without a muffler vs having a muffler, but when the hammer goes down this thing sounds like a whizzed off semi with and angry exhaust note. I took my boy for a ride to pick something up and when we got in I asked him if it sounded any different. He said no. Cruising out of the neighborhood I asked him again and he said no. Once we got out of the neighborhood, I got on it. I looked over at him and he had this ear-to-ear grin going on that was almost too big for his face. I asked him again and he said it sounded like a semi(truck)-racecar. I'm not sure what a semi(truck)-racecar sounds like, but if it sounds like this thing under heavy throttle, then it sounds pretty damn cool. We had a great time listening to the turbo wail and the exhaust howl and ended our day at a weekly car show.

It was a whole bunch of fun. In the end, I'm not sure who laughed more, me or him.
Great times!!

I did add a little bling to the unit this weekend. I have to thank Kert from diy4x for the idea and Scott (mrk5) from Big Horn Graphics for the excellent product.

I will let it speak for itself:



I realize it will not add the twenty hp that a performance parts sticker will, but I like it better anyways.

[83GMCK2500]

Wooo-sah! Sounds awesome. I wish you were closer, I'd love to take a look at that beast, what a great build.

What all does your "full Banks kit" include on the CTD? I don't remember, have you outliend what it has from air filter to tail pipe?

[MrBeast]

Man, I love the window sticker!

I did some of that too this weekend.

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by 83GMCK2500

Wooo-sah! Sounds awesome. I wish you were closer, I'd love to take a look at that beast, what a great build.

Thanks!! It is a real barrel of monkeys now. Ironically I was going to mention that my mileage would suffer from being on the throttle so much while enjoying the new exhaust note, but I filled up today and I still got 19.35mpg!! I have no idea how, but I will take it nonetheless!!

Originally Posted by 83GMCK2500

What all does your "full Banks kit" include on the CTD? I don't remember, have you outliend what it has from air filter to tail pipe?

To be honest, I do not recall exactly what all of the components of the kit were, but a few of the high-points are:
Intercooler
Intercooler tubing
Intake manifold plenum
Wastegated turbo exhaust housing (smaller than oe for faster spool-up with w/gate to control total boost)
I think the kit came with a Banks aif filter, but I could not use the monstrosity that was the oe filter housing.
Turbo downpipe
Gauges, EGT and Boost
Probably some more stuff to justify the ridiculous price of the kit.

If I ever find the sales literature, I will post actual components.

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by MrBeast

Man, I love the window sticker!

Thanks!!

Originally Posted by MrBeast

I did some of that too this weekend.

[LOW DOUGH]

I really liked the part about you and your son going for a ride! I hope that's what my daughter does when she gets older.

Good show!

[mosesburb]

Originally Posted by LOW DOUGH

I really liked the part about you and your son going for a ride! I hope that's what my daughter does when she gets older.

Good show!

Thanks, I hope she does too.

"Dad, can we take the orange truck??" I never get tired of hearing that one. A funny side note on the trip to the car show. We were waiting at a light to go under the freeway and make a left on the other side to go up the on-ramp. Light turns green, go forward, make the left, then I get on the gas--nothing spectacular maybe a 50-75% effort if that. We crest the top of the on-ramp and I look over at my boy who had the veins in his neck sticking out, his arms rigidly trying to push himself up out of his booster seat and a look on his face that he is ready to cry.

Me- "The hell's wrong with you??"
Him- "We're going so fast"
Me- "No we're not" as I punch him in the arm, then point and laugh at him. He finds it is impossible to cry while he is laughing so hard.

I think a vehicle can be a great teaching tool. I would always have him out in the shop while I was working on the Sub. Often he was playing in the dirt, but other times he would have his safety glasses or welding helmet on watching me or helping (or playing in the dirt). Get her own safety glasses and gloves or whatever else, so when you are dinking around with something she has her "own" things to use. Have her help you with the simple things so she has a sense of accomplishment on it. Little things like that, I have found, go a long way.

I am pretty sure my boy was the only one in his kindergarten class that knew how to weld and had actually done it. He had watched me a couple times and I asked if he wanted to try. After a couple tries he was actually doing pretty good--for being five and having a #11 shade in his helmet. I don't let him hang around when I am doing anything heavy, but the light stuff I'll let him watch. He enjoys it and I like having him around.

[lyrikz]

I like stories like that.. My daughter is the same way, ALWAYS wants to sand something on the truck. I need to get her more involved.. just find one piece for her to take care of.

Good story.