Powersteering Advice

[Chaparralman1974]

Good morning everyone!

I have been going back and forth regarding powersteering in my 1967 K20. My truck came with manual "Armstrong" steering. I am to the point where I want to get the steering gear rebuilt. There is a bit of binding in it, and I figured that I would just send it off to either Redhead Steering or Bluetop for a total rebuild. A full rebuild is betweeen $300 and $400 depending on which one I go with plus shipping to and from the rebuilder. So that got me rethinking the idea of powersteering. First off, I am staying with the original closed knuckle axles and I have no intention of swapping it out for an open knuckle. So, from what I understand, in order to add powersteering to my setup, I would need to get one of Captain Fab's adapter plates to mount the steering gear to my frame. Additionally, as I understand it, I would need to shorten the steering arm on the driver side knuckle by about 1 3/4" in order to allow for the pitman arm to move the drag link (which has to be upgraded from the original solid one piece design to the 3 piece setup off of a '73 and up model) in such a way that it doesn't impact the leaf spring brackets. Do I have this summed up in my head correctly? Is there anyone else who has added powersteering to a '67 K10 or K20 AND kept the original axle? I have looked at a couple of threads where guys with '66s and earlier have done it, but I am not 100% sure that the '66 and earlier has the same frame specifics as my '67.


Thanks, Clay

[HO455]

I did a heat and beat on my 67 c10 Burban to put power steering on mine. Before and after photos.

I did the heat and beat so the centerline of the steering box output shaft would stay in the original location. Using a spacer moves the shaft outboard and that results in the truck turning sharper to the right than to the left. (I think that's right. Right or left it still a side effect of the spacer) Some folks are okay with the difference others not so much.

I would think that whatever worked on a 66 would work on a 67.

Have you looked at using the 67 power assist set up? I'm not sure it came on K models or not.

You might also put a post in the 4x4 section. Maybe one the guru's there has the answers you need.

Good luck.

[Chaparralman1974]

I am not sure if the ram assist came on 4x4's or not. In all reality, I think that if I stay stock height then the manual steering should suffice. But, if I decided to go with slightly bigger wheels then I may have an issue. I may end up having to just stay with the manual setup for now.


Clay

[clay68c10]

I would just make the frame clearance for a power box and be done with it. Cut, make a filler, weld, install the box. You won't want to go back and redo this later. No need to overthink it.
No power steering in modern day driving will be unpleasant. I drove mine like that in 1989 in Laramie, WY and it sucked.

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by clay68c10

I would just make the frame clearance for a power box and be done with it. Cut, make a filler, weld, install the box. You won't want to go back and redo this later. No need to overthink it.
No power steering in modern day driving will be unpleasant. I drove mine like that in 1989 in Laramie, WY and it sucked.

You may be right. I am just trying to figure out how to make it work with the stock steering arm on the closed knuckle axle. I think that the bracket that Captain Fab sells will work with my frame.....but I don't know how it will work with that steering arm.


Clay

[Jason Banks]

I think there is a steering box you can buy, that you don't need to dimple the frame or use the spacer. I think it is the one by CPP. I'll search the forum and report back, because I thought someone came up with similar parts store part number....

[Jason Banks]

One more thing. Is your 67 K20 frame completely flat or does it have the dimples?

See this: https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=355133

I have an early production 1968(Oct 1967 Fremont) that didn't have the dimple, but it's a C10 and has the raised bosses. I put spacers that are pretty thin and an off the shelf reman steering gear.

It has not had any noticeable problem with turning radius or anything weird...

[Jason Banks]

Here's the thread about the CP 50014 steering box fitting 1967 with raised bosses, but no dimple.

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=729738 Post #25

[Chaparralman1974]

I just went and double checked and my frame is completely flat. There are no bosses and no dimple.

[Jason Banks]

I'd probably just get the Captain Fab bracket.

Found this: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=724410

And this too: https://tuckersparts.com/products/67...45377526104354

Looks like the captain fab bracket.

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by Jason Banks

I'd probably just get the Captain Fab bracket.

Found this: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=724410

And this too: https://tuckersparts.com/products/67...45377526104354

Looks like the captain fab bracket.

Thanks Jason! I was actually just reading those threads as well!

I went out and took another look at my chassis. I am thinking that the captain fab bracket may just be the ticket for me. I am now trying to figure out the steering arm and drag link. My original drag link is a single piece. I have, for comparison, a 3 piece drag link from a 1973 K20. The challenge as I see it is that the 3 piece drag link has bigger ends than the original. So I am not yet sure how to clearance it to fit with my original steering arm. It looks like it will hit the leaf spring perch. I will try to get some pictures posted later. I think that I will have the same steering arm shortening issue whether or not I go with power steering, so I may as well just upgrade to powersteering no matter what.


Clay

[Jason Banks]

Check this one out too:
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=802339

Doesn't your truck have a lift?

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by Jason Banks

Check this one out too:
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=802339

Doesn't your truck have a lift?

No, my truck is stock. Although, when I had the springs rebuilt, I had them put a 1" positive arch in them.

Here are a few pics I just took of my original drag link and the 73 K20 drag link that I have. I may be over analyzing things as it looks like the newer style may fit without having to clearance anything.

Clay

[Jason Banks]

Slide the axle towards the drivers side...lol

I wonder if new tie rod ends are for the original are smaller diameter?

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by Jason Banks

Slide the axle towards the drivers side...lol

I wonder if new tie rod ends are for the original are smaller diameter?

LOL! That may be an option.

['68OrangeSunshine]

I tried a P/S gearbox from a '69 C/10 Panel Truck on my '67 K/10 Suburban. Total Goat*#ck. The 1967 system used power assisted rams over the existing manual system. The proper MY '67 Power Assist parts are also used on vintage Corvettes, so they cost about 4 times what they're worth.
The '67 -'68 K/10 used a steering sector that swung fore-and-aft. The '69-and Later sectors swing L/R. The geometry doesn't play right.
The brake shop that did the conversion for me cut down my Drag Link to fit.
Once we got on the road, I found it did not fully steer. Turning Right was OK, but Left turns were curtailed. I had to swing left from the center lane to make a U-turn if I wanted to make the curbside lane, otherwise I was in the ditch. The P/S pump fit the late '70s BBC fine, but it was forever sheering off grade 8 bolts, and working itself loose.
We tried to restore the manual steering. I had to get a newer 3-piece drag link to work. Even then the steering geometry was AFU.
My next step for a solution would have been to graft on a '71- and later K/5 Dana 44, which were configured for the L/R steering box, and also adding Power Disc Brakes. An engine fire grounded that truck, since I claimed that on mainstream insurance, and they Totalled it out, and issued a Salvage Title.
My advice is Don't Do It, but K/20s may be different.

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by '68OrangeSunshine

I tried a P/S gearbox from a '69 C/10 Panel Truck on my '67 K/10 Suburban. Total Goat*#ck. The 1967 system used power assisted rams over the existing manual system. The proper MY '67 Power Assist parts are also used on vintage Corvettes, so they cost about 4 times what they're worth.
The '67 -'68 K/10 used a steering sector that swung fore-and-aft. The '69-and Later sectors swing L/R. The geometry doesn't play right.
The brake shop that did the conversion for me cut down my Drag Link to fit.
Once we got on the road, I found it did not fully steer. Turning Right was OK, but Left turns were curtailed. I had to swing left from the center lane to make a U-turn if I wanted to make the curbside lane, otherwise I was in the ditch. The P/S pump fit the late '70s BBC fine, but it was forever sheering off grade 8 bolts, and working itself loose.
We tried to restore the manual steering. I had to get a newer 3-piece drag link to work. Even then the steering geometry was AFU.
My next step for a solution would have been to graft on a '71- and later K/5 Dana 44, which were configured for the L/R steering box, and also adding Power Disc Brakes. An engine fire grounded that truck, since I claimed that on mainstream insurance, and they Totalled it out, and issued a Salvage Title.
My advice is Don't Do It, but K/20s may be different.

Man, that sounds like a total goat f*ck! Now I am wondering if this is even worth it. My frame is totally unmolested and my axle is near pristine. I am not going to lift the truck, so I wonder if I should just rebuild the manual steering gear and call it good.


Clay

[tim_mc]

Check out Borgeson. I will likely upgrade my reman Lares quick ratio to a Borgeson in the future. Here's the link to the K10 box:

https://www.borgeson.com/Power-Steer...0-12-7-1-ratio
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/brg-800133

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by Chaparralman1974

Man, that sounds like a total goat f*ck! Now I am wondering if this is even worth it. My frame is totally unmolested and my axle is near pristine. I am not going to lift the truck, so I wonder if I should just rebuild the manual steering gear and call it good.


Clay

The original 17'' 3-Spoke steering wheel gives you the best leverage. Also start turns when moving, and if possible set up your turn at the stoplight so you're halfway there when the light changes. You need balance and timing to make the Armstrong system work.
Oddly, I saw a 1942 US Army training film about driving the GMC 2-1/2 Ton Deuce-and-a-Half -- 6 x 6 Truck, all manual steering and gearing. It's on You-Tube. Learned a few tricks. If the gears are grinding, stop the synchros from spinning by dropping the clutch in Neutral before clutching and setting into the selected gear. They used to call it Double-Clutching.