1965 C10 LWB Project Build Thread

[JohnIL]

Last weekend, the weather warmed up enough to get the C10 out of winter hibernation and into the shop for some work/play.

Springtime Joy Ride
Since the truck hadn't been run in almost five months, I started by checking the fluids and reconnecting the battery. I parked it last fall with a full tank of fuel, treated with STA-BIL. After sitting for so long, I expected a dry carb and lots of engine cranking. To my surprise, the engine coughed once, then jumped to life. Oil pressure came up immediately and it idled well.

After a few minutes of warm up, I took the truck for a drive in the country to blow the cobwebs out. It really was nice to get the truck back out on the road. Old trucks are good for the soul.

New Fender-mounted Antenna
If you've been following along, you know that I installed a stereo last fall along with a hidden antenna. The hidden antenna worked great, as long as I was holding in free space in the middle of the cab. However, as soon as I set it down or tried to mount it, the reception fell apart completely. I was hoping The hidden antenna was intended to make it easier to cover and uncover the truck without fighting the after market fender-mounted antenna the previous owner had mounted. But, I just can't live with the lousy reception.

Over the winter, I found a better quality fender-mounted antenna on Amazon. This one is intended as a replacement for 1980's GM J-body's like the Chevy Celebrity and the Buick Century. There were two features that stood out. First, the antenna came with five different angled bases, allowing me to choose the right angle for the fender without any crazy pivot screws. Two, because the angled bases are fixed, the antenna mast unscrews from the base, just like a factory antenna would. When I want to throw the cover on the truck, I can easily unscrew the antenna mast to get it out of the way.

Metra 44-GM935:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The new antenna has MUCH better reception than the hidden antenna or the old antenna that was previously on the fender. Mission accomplished.

New Upper Radiator Hose
This seems like a simple maintenance item, but because the engine isn't original to the truck, finding a radiator that fit correctly was like solving a murder mystery. The previous owner installed a universal flexi-hose, which looked like garbage. I thought about trying a reproduction of the original steel tube-style hoses, but they're pretty pricey and I'm not sure I have the correct water neck angle. So, I went in search of a rubber replacement that might fit. Over the winter, I read a suggestion here on the forum. This hose was cheap (only $12) and it was almost a perfect fit.

Dayco 70344:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

If you have a later model small block in your truck with an original-style radiator, give this hose a try. I had to trim a couple of inches off of one end of the hose, and the radiator end was a tight fit, but the angle was perfect and it looks a whole lot better than the silly flexi-hose.

Bucket Seats (Part 1)
And now, the part you've all been waiting for. I started working on installing the new ProCar low back bucket seats. First off, I love the way these seats look. They have the perfect look for a classic truck. The only thing that would make them better is two-tone blue/white covers, like the factory bench seats. Maybe someday...

I started by removing the clapped out square body bench seat that the previous owner installed. It served the purpose, but they vinyl was torn, the springs were bent, and the foam padding was shot. Once I had the old seat out of the way, I found something I hadn't noticed when I had the seat out last fall. I found extra holes in the cab floor. Apparently, at some point in the past, somebody else had bucket seats in this truck. I wonder what happened to them?

With the cab emptied out, I set the new driver side bucket in place. As I expected, the slider mounts set the seat about 5" too low. So, I set about fabricating a set of seat risers. This turned out to be tougher than I expected.

Initially, I thought I could get away with four individual "uprights", one on each corner of the seat. But, this turned out to be too flimsy. There is enough flex in the sliders that the seat wiggled all over the place. Next, I tied the front and rear uprights together with a strip of bar stock. This gave me two risers, one for the left side of the seat, one for the right side of the seat. This eliminated the front-to-back flex, but there was still too much side-to-side flex. So, I added a two more strips of bar stock to tie the two sides together. This formed one solid riser for all four corners. The flex was all but eliminated. But, there was another problem.

With the uprights positioned directly below the four slider mounting points, the seat was too far to the left. The two right corners of the riser were sitting against the transmission tunnel. So, out came the cutting wheel. I moved the two right-side uprights toward the center of the seat by 1 1/2" and added 1 1/2 "ears to mount the seat to. Then, I tied the four uprights back together with bar stock. This allowed me to move the whole rig (seat, slider, and riser) closer to the center of the cab.

You can see the finished (but still unpainted) driver-side riser in the picture below. I'm pretty happy with the way the riser turned out. The seat sits high enough to be comfortable and there should be plenty of space under the seats for jumper cables, gloves, etc. I have all of the steel cut for the passenger-side riser, but I ran out of warm weather. We've been back down near freezing all week. As soon as we get some warm weather again, I will weld up the second riser and get the seats mounted in the cab. More to come...

[JohnIL]

The weather took pity on me over the weekend and I spent a day finishing the installation of the ProCar lowback bucket seats.

Since my last installment, we've only had a few workable evenings. I spent that time welding up the seat riser for the passenger side, painting the seat risers, and installing the driver side riser. The first one took a few hours to get located and mounted.

This weekend, I mounted the passenger seat. This one only took a few minutes because I learned how to avoid the mistakes on the first one.

Once the seats were installed, I reinstalled the buckle end of the seatbelts. The mounting brackets I fabbed to mount the belts for the old bench seat were a bit too tall and they needed to be turned 90 degrees. Now, the belts are positioned perfectly (or pretty darned close) for the new buckets.

With the new buckets in place, I fabbed up a mounting bracket for my rear speakers. The bracket bolts to the floor and raises the speakers up above the seat belts. This is only a temporary solution until I make the leap to a frame mounted gas tank. Once the gas tank is out of the cab, I'll have gobs of space for the speakers behind the seats.

Now that it's all installed, I'm thrilled with the seats. They're comfortable and they have the right look for a classic truck. Two enthusiastic thumbs up!

[joesscamaro]

The seats look right at home...thank you for the update.

[88Stanger]

Damn fine job sir!!! looks awesome

[Braunschweiger]

Yes, looks really great, congratulations

[SCOTI]

Seats & mounting

I'm not feeling the speaker arrangement in all honesty though. Different strokes for diff folks & all that rainbow glitter aside..... They're too 'visually prominent' for me so it draws you to them vs them being a discreet addition.

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Seats & mounting

I'm not feeling the speaker arrangement in all honesty though. Different strokes for diff folks & all that rainbow glitter aside..... They're too 'visually prominent' for me so it draws you to them vs them being a discreet addition.

Scoti,
I know exactly what you're saying. The speaker location doesn't fit the look of the truck and it's definitely not ideal for sound quality. Once I get the fuel tank out of the cab, I plan to move the speakers back behind the seats. Before the buckets, I had the speakers under the bench seat. They were too muffled to be of any real use. I would like them to be more-or-less hidden from view without being muffled by the seats. The current arrangement is a temporary measure to get me by until the fuel tank relocation.

John

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by JohnIL

Scoti,
I know exactly what you're saying. The speaker location doesn't fit the look of the truck and it's definitely not ideal for sound quality. Once I get the fuel tank out of the cab, I plan to move the speakers back behind the seats. Before the buckets, I had the speakers under the bench seat. They were too muffled to be of any real use. I would like them to be more-or-less hidden from view without being muffled by the seats. The current arrangement is a temporary measure to get me by until the fuel tank relocation.

John

Gotcha. Small steps.

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Gotcha. Small steps.

Exactly! I want to keep the truck drivable as I work through my list of projects.

At some point, I'll have to take the truck off the road long enough to gut the interior to fix the rusty floor pans and cab supports. That will be my opportunity to repaint the interior, soundproof, replace the carpet, etc. The first step in that process will be relocating the fuel tank.

But, the fuel tank relocation won't happen until I'm ready to pull the bed off the frame to clean up the back half of the chassis.

That won't happen until I get the front end rebuilt and converted to power disk brakes.

So, the speaker location is only temporary. I figure it should only take 10-15 years to move the speakers to their permanent location behind the seats.

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by Braunschweiger

Yes, looks really great, congratulations

Originally Posted by 88Stanger

Damn fine job sir!!! looks awesome

Originally Posted by joesscamaro

The seats look right at home...thank you for the update.

Thanks for the encouragement guys! I need all I can get!

[rbruno68]

The steelie rims look great. I have a set of K truck ralleys, but I am starting to like the steelies and caps more and more. I have a while before they go on my truck to decide, but yours look great.

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by rbruno68

The steelie rims look great. I have a set of K truck ralleys, but I am starting to like the steelies and caps more and more. I have a while before they go on my truck to decide, but yours look great.

Thanks Bruno! I can't identify them for certain, but I think they are an old set of US Wheel Series 51 "Smoothie" wheels. They are 16" x 8" 6-lugs.

John

[JohnIL]

That Danged Carburetor
So, I think I finally found a solution for the cantankerous Holley carb. I threw it out the window! That's right, I finally gave up fighting the Holley and replaced it with an Edelbrock.

If you've been following along from the beginning, I'm sure you're sick of hearing about my feeble attempts to tune the Holley 600 that came with the truck. In my last update, I mentioned that I had new #68 primary jets ordered. I installed the new jets along with a new 6.5 power valve. That finally fixed the lean stumble... For about two days... It ran beautifully for just over a hundred miles. Then, the engine started surging violently at light throttle and it died completely at idle. I'm pretty sure all of my tinkering dislodged some crud and fouled the idle circuit somewhere. I'm certain that a rebuild would put back right, but I was out of patience with the Holley. Really Holley, it's not you, it's me. It's just not going work out between us.

So, mysteriously, a brand new Edelbrock AVS2 650 arrived in the garage and found its way under the hood of the C10. I'm sure the Holley could be fixed, but it was time to try something new. I pulled the new Edelbrock from the box and plopped it on the intake. And, guess what, the engine ran perfectly. Well OK, not perfectly, but pretty darned close. The engine started, idled, and ran very well. I set the idle speed, adjusted the idle mixture a bit, and set the fast idle choke speed. Done. That's it. No more tuning needed. The engine idles smooth, pulls hard through the gears, and clearly has better low end torque. Thanks Vic!

While I was at it, I installed a 1" phenolic spacer to help with the hot fuel evaporation. When the engine is hot, it still takes a bit to refill the bowls, but it's definitely better than it was before, without the spacer.

There might be a slightly used Holley 600 available on eBay soon. It would be a perfect rebuild candidate for someone who knows more about tuning Holley's than I do. It really is a nice carb. It's just beyond my know-how and patience.

Electrical Fixes - Alternator, Ignition Switch, and Starter
I mentioned in my last update that I replaced the alternator. The new one seemed to be charging OK, but occasionally, I had trouble with a "dead battery". After driving and parking, the truck wouldn't restart. Click. Just click. Then, one day, I noticed that if I tried the key a few times, it would eventually start. The battery clearly wasn't dead. I just wasn't getting reliable voltage to the starter solenoid.

I suspected the problem might be the ignition switch, because of some electrical hackery by the previous owner. So, I installed a new switch. While I was at it, I replaced the ignition lock cylinder. The old one wasn't the original style anyway. Everything worked OK for a couple of weeks, then click returned.

Then, I had an epiphany. About a year ago, I replaced the starter because the PO had overtightened both the battery cable lug and the ignition wire lug and cracked the housing. Being paranoid about cracking the new starter housing, I purposely did not overtighten the lugs. That is to say, I undertightened the lugs. They weren't lose, exactly, but they weren't tight either. I gave both lugs a bit more snugging and the mystery click seems to be solved. Time will tell.

Electrical Fixes - Tail Lights and Marker Lights
When I first bought the truck, I had a flaky tail light. I thought I had if fixed with a new light bulb, but it's always been dimmer (not as bright) as the other tail light. It dawned on me the the other day that not only was the tail light dim, but so was the brake light. That told me that problem was something that impacts the whole socket, not just one circuit. The problem turned out to be a sketchy ground. The original light bucket was rusty and the light socket was corroded. I little emory cloth got things shined up. It's working well now, but the bucket and trim ring are both pretty banged up. So, I ordered a new set of tail light housings, light sockets, and new lenses. When those arrive, I'll go through the wiring and add new dedicated ground wires to both tail light housings.

Speaking of dim lights, one of my front marker lights (the right one) has always been dimmer than the other one. A few months ago, I connected the brown tail light wire to the purple wire for the front running lights. This turns the front running lights on, even with the head lights on. The problem was, at the same time, I lost the right turn signals when the headlights were on. Since I was messing around with the tail lights, I decided to dig into the front marker problem too.

If you are familiar with the wiring of the front marker lights, you've probably already guessed what was going on. Someone, in the past replaced the light socket on the left front marker light. They reversed the two wires (marker light and turn signal). The dim right light was wired correctly. The running light function is supposed to be dim. Then, when you turn on the turn signal, it flashes MUCH brighter. Because the wires on the left light were reversed, the bright circuit was lit at the wrong time. When I connected the brown wire, I made things worse by causing a short between the running light circuit and the turn signal circuit.

Once I corrected the wiring, everything started working. The running lights come on with the tail lights and both turn signals work, with and without the headlights.


Electrical Upgrades - Auxiliary Fuse Block, Cell Phone Charger, and Courtesy Lights
When I installed the bucket seats and built the console, I added an inductive cell phone charger on the console lid, but I never connected the power. I was a little leery of adding one more current draw to the ignition switch. So, I added an auxiliary fuse panel next to the factory replacement fuse panel installed by the previous owner. The factory replacement panel didn't have any unused keyed circuits, but it did have an unused keyed tap. I used that tap to feed the new panel. Now, I have fused circuits for the keyed accessories I've added in the cab, like the stereo, the tach, and the new inductive cell phone charger. And, I have three more unused fused circuits for future toys. If I add any high-draw accessories, I will use the keyed tap to switch a dedicated relay to power the auxiliary fuse panel.

Next on my list was a feature we take for granted in our modern daily drivers. This truck had no interior courtesy lights. The only interior light was the dome light, powered by the rotating headlight switch. It was terribly inconvenient at night. Sometimes, it was down right dangerous. Luckily, LMC sells a simple set of door plunger switches and under-dash courtesy lights. Wiring them up was tedious, but simpler than I expected.

Basically, here's how if works. You install the plunger switches in the door jambs. Next, you tie the plunger switches, the black ground wire from each of the new courtesy lights, and the ground wire to the dome light circuit all together. Then, you tie the white power wire from each of the new courtesy lights and the power wire from the dome light circuit all together. Now, when either of the doors is opened, the plunger switch grounds the whole circuit and the dome light and the new courtesy lights all come on. And, if the doors are closed and you rotate the headlight switch all the way to the dome light function, the dome light and the new courtesy lights all come on. It's downright futuristic! I can't recommend this upgrade enough. It's really nice to be able to see to get in and out of the cab at night.

What's next?
When the new tail lights arrive, I'll get them installed.

I'm also going to replace the cooling system thermostat with a 160 degree unit and add a fan shroud. The engine doesn't really get hot, but it hovers around 190 on hot days. I'd like to see that come down a few more degrees.

[Braunschweiger]

You've done a lot, I had to smile a little at the carburetor story, an Edelbrock is really easier there.
Your cabin is a jewel.

[SCOTI]

Nice updates.

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by Braunschweiger

You've done a lot, I had to smile a little at the carburetor story, an Edelbrock is really easier there.
Your cabin is a jewel.

Thanks Harald! I've enjoyed watching your truck come together. Your work is an inspiration.

John

[rbruno68]

I can see this is how I will work on mine. Little bit at a time. Do a handful of small things in a weekend and still enjoy driving all the while. Truck looks great.
Rob

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by rbruno68

I can see this is how I will work on mine. Little bit at a time. Do a handful of small things in a weekend and still enjoy driving all the while. Truck looks great.
Rob

Thanks Rob. That's exactly the idea. At some point, I'll have to take the truck off the road for longer periods for bigger projects (disk brake conversion, transmission swap, body repairs, etc.). But, my goal is to be able to enjoy the truck while I'm working on it. Of course, it would be more efficient to just tear it all apart and do everything all at once, but that would disable the truck for years. This way keeps the truck drivable. I like to drive the truck, even if it's nowhere close to "finished".

John

[JohnIL]

Over the weekend, my son and I took the C10 to the 2nd Annual Southern Illinois Truck Showdown in Marion, IL. I didn't get many pictures because we were so busy talking to people about their trucks.

The show was fantastic. There were hundreds of classic and custom trucks in attendance. This is, by far, the largest show we've ever been to. We had a great time. We met tons of great people and saw tons of great trucks. The 60-66 era was well represented!

We met Robbie from United By Trucks. If you haven't seen his YouTube channel, you should check it out. After meeting Robbie in person, I appreciate him even more than I did before. He's gracious, sharing, and passionate about old trucks. He treated my son and I like old friends. He's an excellent ambassador for the classic truck community.

We live about four hours from Marion and we had to make the drive over night. So, rather than driving the C10, we opted for towing it behind my daily driver pickup. That feels like a cop-out, but I didn't want to take the chance of breaking down along the interstate in the middle of the night.

My goal is to have the truck sorted well enough to drive it to next year's show. That means that I need to get cracking on the power disc brakes and the overdrive transmission.

It was fun weekend. Now it's time to get back to work on that truck!

[JohnIL]

The Expanded-Use Antique license plates on the C10 "wake up" on March 1. So, over the weekend, I roused the truck from winter hibernation. I connected the battery, pumped the gas three times, hit the key, and the old small block jumped back to life. It was definitely good to hear. I warmed up the engine, took a quick spin around the block, and pulled back in the driveway.

There's still salt on the roads, so that's about it, until we get some spring rains to wash away a winter's worth of sodium chloride. There's rain in the forecast this week. So, soon...

I have a mountain of parts for the truck, but I don't know how much I'll have time for this spring and summer. Over the winter, I had carpal tunnel surgery on both wrists. Once that started to heal up, I dug into a kitchen remodel that I promised my wife over 20 years ago (Better late than never?). I hope to have that wrapped up before the Easter family gathering. Then, it's C10 time, right? Not so fast.

This is my son's last summer at home before he goes off to school and we have a lot of work that needs to be done to his car before it's ready to travel (and sit in a parking lot for nine months). We need to focus on finishing the bodywork on his 1983 El Camino and getting it all one color, even if that color is primer gray. We also need to install the snazzy new cruise control unit he got for Christmas.

Just because you can't have too many trucks sitting in the driveway, I picked up a GMC OBS utility truck a couple of months ago. It needs some mechanical work, so it can start earning it's keep. I don't think I'll bother posting much about the OBS on the forum, but you never know.

And, because that's still not enough trucks sitting in the driveway, my son (yes, the same son) is working on buying a square body Chevy. He says he wants a pickup to drive to school so he can keep the El Camino safe at home. He's paying for the pickup with his summer job earnings and he wants to try to fix this one up himself (with a little bit of help from Dad, of course). It's hard to argue with a teenager who is actually taking personal responsibility for his own ride. Assuming he gets a truck purchased, this one will definitely end up with a build thread on the forum. And, if a square body does materialize this spring, it will very likely jump in line ahead of the El Camino.

With all of that said, here's what I have stockpiled for the '65 C10:

• Power Brake kit
• Front Disk Brakes
• Front suspension bushings, tie rods, etc.
• Power Steering kit
• New Steering column
• LED Headlights
• Hidden tailgate latches and support cables

That's a lot of work and there's no way it's all getting done this summer. There are too many other competing priorities. For now, I'm going to install the Holley RetroBright LED headlights and the tailgate hardware. That may be it for this year, but these minor improvements will add a lot of safety, functionality, and convenience. I'll do short write-ups when I do these installs. The more time consuming work may have to wait until the boy is off to college.

Anyway, I'm glad that spring has arrived. It's finally classic truck season again!

[SCOTI]

That's a pile-o-work on the docket! Despite that, there's a bunch that should occupy too much time/effort to knock out so hopefully things go smoothly.

Kudo's to the young-gun for his direction as well....

[rbruno68]

That is a good score.
Rob

[JohnIL]

Now that spring has finally arrived in Central Illinois, it's time to get back out to the garage. The good news is, I have plenty of fun projects to work on. The bad news is, not all of those projects are on my '65 C10.

As I posted recently, a few weeks ago, my son picked up a C10 of his own (a '77 Silverado). We've spent most of our garage time getting it back on the road. There's still quite a bit of work to do, but it's getting closer to roadworthy.

While my son was working this weekend, I took a break from his truck to spend some quality time with my own. I checked a couple of modernization/practicality upgrades off my list.

Tailgate Chain Delete
I like the "old truck aesthetic" of the tailgate chains, but I open and close the tailgate enough to make the chains a pain in the rear. And, the chains don't support the tailgate level with the bed. They sag and the tailgate hangs at an odd downward angle.

So, over the winter, I went in search of a tailgate cable and latch conversion. I wasn't really excited by the ones available on the market. They're expensive and overly complicated. So, I set out to build my own.

I started with a set of tailgate cables for a '07-'16 Silverado. They're cheap and readily available.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CGRDN4DP...lig_dp_it&th=1

Next, I found a set of stainless steel spring-loaded latches. Again, cheap and readily available.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B41XJ77B...lig_dp_it&th=1

The rest was simple fabrication work.

• I welded a flange nut (inserted backwards) into the corner stake pocket. This acts as a bung to hold the upper end of the support cable. The cables come with shoulder bolts for this end of the cable.
• Next, I cut and shaped a length of 1 1/4" angle steel into a bracket that acts both as an anchor point for the lower end of the cable and as a mounting point for the latch. I mounted the bracket to the tailgate using a pair of rivnuts (one at the top of the tailgate, one at the bottom. You have to avoid the middle of the tailgate because a hole here would be visible from the outside. The latch is mounted to the bracket using a pair of 8-32 stainless machine screws threaded into holes tapped in the bracket.
• Then, I mounted the latch striker plates to the corner stake pockets, above the cable mounting bolt. I had to fab a couple of 1/4" thick steel spacers to give the striker plates the necessary clearance for the latches. The striker and spacers are mounted using more stainless 8-32 machine bolts into holes tapped in the stake pocket.
• I repeated the whole operation on the other side of the truck
• I sprayed the brackets and spacers flat black to match the truck and set them aside over night.
• The next morning, I assembled the whole works.
• Finally, I cleaned up the installation by removing the tailgate chains, bolts, and brackets, and touching up the rusty holes with some more flat black.
• Someday, when I redo the body work, I'll weld in patches to smoot out the empty bolt and bracket holes.

LED Headlights
Last summer, I installed a set of high intensity headlight bulbs. They were better than the original T3's, but they were still a far cry from the LED headlights we're used to on our daily drivers. I didn't feel safe driving the '65 at night with all of the modern vehicles (and their glaring headlights) on the road. So, I stepped up and bought a pair of Holley RetroBright headlights. They're pricey, but if you plan to drive your classic truck at night, they are totally worth it. Safety is a good place focus your project budget.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Holle...SAAEgJCL_D_BwE

The installation was fairly simple. Just pull out the old bulbs and pop in the new ones. The pigtails on the RetroBrights plug right into the factory headlight harness, or in my case, the upgraded headlight harness I installed last summer. I had to correct the headlight aim a bit, but that's to be expected whenever you remove and replace the bulbs.

I'll also note how good the RetroBright's look. Most LED bulbs look much too modern for a classic vehicle. Holley did a very good job making the RetroBright lenses look like vintage bulbs. They look right at home on a '60's pickup. You can see a comparison shot below between the RetroBright (driver side) and the high-intensity incandescent (passenger side). The RetroBright is a lot "whiter" than vintage, but the lens pattern mimics the old T3's much better. When they're turned off, you have to look closely for the "Holley" logo to know they're not vintage bulbs.

Last night, after sundown, I went for a drive to try out the new lighting. The results are impressive. The RetroBrights are significantly brighter than the old high-intensity bulbs and they do a much better job of throwing light sideways toward the ditches. This is a huge safety advantage, especially when the critters are twitterpated and frolicking near the roadways. The low beams don't seem quite as bright as those on my '21 GMC, but the high beams throw light WAY out ahead of the truck. This upgrade makes a huge improvement in terms of safety and practicality.

[SCOTI]

Nicely done x2.

[JohnIL]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Nicely done x2.

Thanks Scoti! I don't know if I'll get the chance to do any of the major upgrades this season (power brakes and power steering), but these little projects will make the truck a whole lot more usable in the meantime.

John