"hook lift" on a C60

[greywuuf]

Just wondering if any of you have ever built, used or dealt with a "hook lift" truck?
Many of the newer small and medium duty waste disposal and recycling trucks are equipped with them, If you are not familiar it is kind of a combined dump/rollback/self loader. it is a two stage tilt and roll back that actually sets the bed on the gound.

I ask because i am building a 'welders" bed for my C-60 to mount my old almost free Licoln Ranger 8 welder on... hopefull something with a beavertail,I imagine something like a diamond plate old school to truck/wrecker bed. I also need a small clean Flat bed for hauling my WWII studebaker Weasels ( small amphibious track rigs) on... I was hoping to have easily interchangeable beds. however a "proffesional/commercial" setup is in the $20,000 range. I was wondering if it was feasable to construct one from and maybe repourpose a dump bed cylinder.

For those of you that need pictures and more explaination here is a link
http://www.stellarindustries.com/pages/hooklifts.htm

thanks
Dan

[special-K]

I have friends who have trucks set up with hook lifts. It's a great idea I have always wanted to implement on a medium duty for multi-purpose roll-on/roll-off bodies. We have built bodies such as flatbeds,boxes,and even specialized designs. If I ever get a medium duty that's how I want to set it up.

[greywuuf]

Special-K, So having been around them, do you think it is feasable to build one ? ( nevermind the liability and legality) and do you know if they have been around long enough to possibly pick up a truck with one installed at a reasonable price ?

[fixit-p]

Sure it is feasable to build one but they are not as simple as they seem. Below is a drawing I jacked from the internet. They need two pivot points A and B and for it to be able to pivot on B for dumping the two sections have to be able to interlock in the area of pivot A. Galbreath uses a linkage and Stellar uses a sliding lock. Also they typically need higher operating pressures than a typical rolloff to operate. The hook gantry can either tilt or telescope. I just put a load cell system on a Stellar a while back I'll check if I have any pics of the interlock.

[greywuuf]

Fixit-p: thank you for the response, and yes I was aware of the two pivot, though I have not gotten a chance to view one in person. I figured there would be some math and some trial and error in the two pivot points. I have Downloaded the Stellar install manuals and looked at everything I can find on line. I noticed the increased pressure they are running at but I still wonder if they NEED to or if they just chose to, as i am sure a dump truck lift cylinder can do the job, I mean the power is a function of pressure and area.... I would think you could design a large enough cylinder to use the lower pressure and more readily available (cheaper) hydraulic system.

thanks again for the drawing the more info I can get the better off I am.

Dan

[fixit-p]

The elevated pressure is needed for it to work, when loading it is working on the retract cycle of the cylinder so the effective area is piston area minus rod area. And when dumping you have the effective area of the piston but the geometry of the pivots and the fact that the cylinder is at a shallow angle requires more force to get it started.

[C10 - C90 Bill]

Interesting. I never heard of one or seen one. I just watched the video and it looked good, but I'm trying to find out what advantage does a Hook Lift system have over a typical Roll-Off?

[greywuuf]

I cant answer that as i am not familiar with a "roll off" the hook lift is the only system I know that is self loading. (unless a roll off is not also a dump bed? because a hook lift is )

Fixit-p hmm I can see that point, it looks like a pretty "poor" mechanical advantage but I still say a bigger cylinder would do it at lower pressures. the disadvantage is a bigger Cylinder requires more volume and thus more time... an issue in a Working scenario, not so much if it is only used to change out the beds say once a month or something.

[Vintage Windmills]

Interesting, lots of engineering involved there. You can figure out all the pivots on paper with a compass and ruler and grid paper. Google 4 bar mechanism design (pivot point method) This takes me back. Years ago, I wrote a computer program to calculate the pivots for 4 and a special types of 6 bar mechanisms to get it right before anything is built but the problem is getting all the inputs (box size, truck frame length, range of heights you can put pivots on truck frame. Then of course all the other calc's to size the pivots, grade of steel, size of steel, etc.

Looks like the main advantage is the box doesn't slide or roll off when loaded/unloaded.

[greywuuf]

Hey! Vintage Windmills..... I have a tape measure and lots of time, Are you busy ? lol

[Vintage Windmills]

I would like to help but just to busy now to do it right. Hit me up in March, maybe I will have some free hours then. For now, I think you could figure it out with the compass method- google that, if you cant find good explanations I can at least help you out with some explanation of that.

[greywuuf]

Don't worry, I have plenty of time to toy with the idea... the rest of the truck is a serious mess.
Thank you for the pointers though, and i am considering the 2x4 and lag bolt and many drilled holes method ( trial and error) as well.

[powerdriver 1958]

FYI , It would be slow but a steering pump will build 2100 lbs of pressure

[special-K]

Originally Posted by C10 - C90 Bill

Interesting. I never heard of one or seen one. I just watched the video and it looked good, but I'm trying to find out what advantage does a Hook Lift system have over a typical Roll-Off?

I think the difference is a roll-on uses a winch and cable to drag the body/container on and the hook lifts are levers/arms? I guess it's cable vs hydraulic,like cranes.

I'm not sure how long they've been around,but give it time and there will be old dumpster trucks for cheap for donors.

[C10 - C90 Bill]

Here is a good example of a Roll Off:

WM roll-off recycling containers in Waseca-...

This one is a Recycling Container, but could very easily be a Dump Truck as well.

Bill

[C10 - C90 Bill]

Here is one Dumping:

Drop Box Dump - YouTube

It's dumping trash, but you could make a Dump Body on a smaller scale for Sand and Gravel, a Flat Bed for hauling Lumber, Logs, etc, even a small Tanker for hauling Water, Fuel, etc.

...Now you got me thinking.

Bill

[fixit-p]

Originally Posted by C10 - C90 Bill

Interesting. I never heard of one or seen one. I just watched the video and it looked good, but I'm trying to find out what advantage does a Hook Lift system have over a typical Roll-Off?

The hook lift has 3 advantages over a rolloff 1, it loads faster 2, driver doesn't have to leave cab of truck and 3, they are slightly lighter.

Originally Posted by greywuuf

Fixit-p hmm I can see that point, it looks like a pretty "poor" mechanical advantage but I still say a bigger cylinder would do it at lower pressures. the disadvantage is a bigger Cylinder requires more volume and thus more time... an issue in a Working scenario, not so much if it is only used to change out the beds say once a month or something.

The unit I installed the load cell system on had an 8" bore cylinder, but it really would depend on how much you want to be able to lift. You could also use twin cylinders for the lift. A rolloff would be much easier and cheaper to build but maybe not as much cool factor.
There are some decent drawings in the Galbreath installation manual which shows their interlock among other things.

[C10 - C90 Bill]

Originally Posted by fixit-p

The hook lift has 3 advantages over a rolloff 1, it loads faster 2, driver doesn't have to leave cab of truck and 3, they are slightly lighter.

Appreciate the additional info on it. In my case though, if I were to build one, I would probably stay with a Roll Off type. I wouldn't mind dealing with the minor dis-advantages in comparison, but I can see how a big volume modern trucking outfit would want to utilize them. It is an interesting system.

Bill

[greywuuf]

This is about the heaviest item I can see me wanting to "hook"


it weights about 3500 pounds, just trying to decide if it would be worth the "wow" factor to just have it set up to hook this without the flat bed....I know it would be more practical just to load this on a flat bed, but i think it would be 'neat" to just grab the front pintal hook on this and load it right onto the frame rails ;-)