Dana 44 Closed Knuckle Axle Shaft U-Joint Part Number

[Short 3/4]

Well now you guys have me (over?) thinking about this whole seal or no seal thing. While I still stand by my original thought that it probably doesn’t matter either way, Jeff brought up a really interesting theory. It all made sense until I realized that the knuckle fill hole is about at the center of the axle shaft, so the analogy would be more like constantly dipping the paint brush into a can of paint, not spinning it dry. This would force grease in with every rotation.

While I don’t have access to part numbers to prove it, I’m thinking that the same u joint is used for both open and closed knuckles and you simply leave the seal on for open (to retain grease) and remove it for closed (to replenish the grease). It makes sense to me, but if not the case, please let me know as I’m here to learn, not preach.

On another subject, I hope you know to replace the oil seals just outboard of the pumpkin. It’s a real PITA but needs to be done while you’re in there, as they are probably original and will cause no end of problems if they start leaking.

Keep up the great work
Tom

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by Short 3/4

Well now you guys have me (over?) thinking about this whole seal or no seal thing. While I still stand by my original thought that it probably doesn’t matter either way, Jeff brought up a really interesting theory. It all made sense until I realized that the knuckle fill hole is about at the center of the axle shaft, so the analogy would be more like constantly dipping the paint brush into a can of paint, not spinning it dry. This would force grease in with every rotation.

While I don’t have access to part numbers to prove it, I’m thinking that the same u joint is used for both open and closed knuckles and you simply leave the seal on for open (to retain grease) and remove it for closed (to replenish the grease). It makes sense to me, but if not the case, please let me know as I’m here to learn, not preach.

On another subject, I hope you know to replace the oil seals just outboard of the pumpkin. It’s a real PITA but needs to be done while you’re in there, as they are probably original and will cause no end of problems if they start leaking.

Keep up the great work
Tom

Hmm.....now I am rethinking it as well. I don't think it can hurt either way really. If the seals are left off, then it should recieve lubrication as long as the knuckle cavity is full. With the seals on, it never needs lubrication (just like the ones that are in drive lines and such any more). I am tending towards just leaving the seals on and using the lubricant in the joint to keep the knuckle bearings lubricated if anything.

Yeah, I am replacing the inner axle seals. I pulled the carrier out the other day and noticed that the seals were crumbling apart. The nice thing about the older carrier setups is that the shims are between the carrier and the bearing and not the bearing and the housing. So reassembly will be a piece of cake. I would imagine that initial setup for preload and backlash would be a pain though.

Clay

[jeffahart]

The inner on my driver side got to the point where I couldn't ignore it anymore. So I did axle upgrades and the inner seals last summer. I used the seal install tool, made it a bit easier. I replaced all the shafts, bearings and hubs ect... while I was at it. I just did a quick sanity check with the dial indicator before I closed it up. I checked it before I dropped it out and no change.

j

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by jeffahart

The inner on my driver side got to the point where I couldn't ignore it anymore. So I did axle upgrades and the inner seals last summer. I used the seal install tool, made it a bit easier. I replaced all the shafts, bearings and hubs ect... while I was at it. I just did a quick sanity check with the dial indicator before I closed it up. I checked it before I dropped it out and no change.

j

I have tore the entire axle down and removed the ring and pinion. My plan is to replace all the seals, clean and paint everything. I also picked up the seal installation tool. They are cheap enough rather than trying to beat the seal into place. I am also planning on replacing both U-Joints. Fortunately, all of the bearings are in excellent condition, so I can reuse those. I am also going to swap over the Spicer big hubs to the closed knuckle axle as well. I did end up cleaning the original Hub-Loks and I will keep them around for giggles, but I think that the Spicer hubs just look cooler. :-)


Clay

[jeffahart]

Originally Posted by Chaparralman1974

I have tore the entire axle down and removed the ring and pinion. My plan is to replace all the seals, clean and paint everything. I also picked up the seal installation tool. They are cheap enough rather than trying to beat the seal into place. I am also planning on replacing both U-Joints. Fortunately, all of the bearings are in excellent condition, so I can reuse those. I am also going to swap over the Spicer big hubs to the closed knuckle axle as well. I did end up cleaning the original Hub-Loks and I will keep them around for giggles, but I think that the Spicer hubs just look cooler. :-)


Clay

Where'd you get the hubs? Those things probably cost more than my Yukons. I fried a spinde and hub on my 44 back in the 80s, so it had warrens. The 60 had standards. I'm buying new tires in the next few days when I have time. I'm moving up to 35s. Then I will think about gearing. I put a gear vendors in a couple weeks ago, did not like it and sent it back. Cost me a drive shaft, two quarts of oil and return shipping. So I may have my axles apart again if the 35s don't get me where I want to be. I didn't pull the trigger on a locker for my front when I put in the new axles either, I wanted to see what the gear vendor would do. I might just truetrac the front. Although I'm tempted to ditch the detroint locker also. The decisions never end. Fun hobby though!

j

[Short 3/4]

Originally Posted by jeffahart

Where'd you get the hubs? Those things probably cost more than my Yukons. I fried a spinde and hub on my 44 back in the 80s, so it had warrens. The 60 had standards. I'm buying new tires in the next few days when I have time. I'm moving up to 35s. Then I will think about gearing. I put a gear vendors in a couple weeks ago, did not like it and sent it back. Cost me a drive shaft, two quarts of oil and return shipping. So I may have my axles apart again if the 35s don't get me where I want to be. I didn't pull the trigger on a locker for my front when I put in the new axles either, I wanted to see what the gear vendor would do. I might just truetrac the front. Although I'm tempted to ditch the detroint locker also. The decisions never end. Fun hobby though!

j

The Detroit is definitely a love it or hate it thing. I’ve had mine for over 30 years and wouldn’t want to be without it. In fact I’ve had the same one in two different trucks. I can sure see how people would hate them though, and would never have one if I lived in snow.
When I recently went through my front end I put in a TrueTrack. Was afraid it wouldn’t be a good idea, especially since I have manual steering, but has been great both on and off road. I have TrueTracks front and rear in my other Brand X truck and that’s worked out really well. Never know they are there until you don’t get stuck!
Tom

[jeffahart]

Originally Posted by Short 3/4

The Detroit is definitely a love it or hate it thing. I’ve had mine for over 30 years and wouldn’t want to be without it. In fact I’ve had the same one in two different trucks. I can sure see how people would hate them though, and would never have one if I lived in snow.
When I recently went through my front end I put in a TrueTrack. Was afraid it wouldn’t be a good idea, especially since I have manual steering, but has been great both on and off road. I have TrueTracks front and rear in my other Brand X truck and that’s worked out really well. Never know they are there until you don’t get stuck!
Tom

Ya, thanks for the info. I've had the detroits in a lot of trucks, seems everytime I get an axle it has a detroit. I always swear I'm going to ditch them. The only one I've ever gotten rid of is the one in the HO52 I got rid of for this axle my current corp 14. Nobody wanted the HO52 so I stripped it down. I gave the parts away to people on this board. I sent the 4.10 gears to a guy back east, and the detroit to a guy in Sylmar Ca, with a bunch of brake parts. I gave away the front 44 4.10 ring and pinion also. Couldn't give the front 44 away either.

I built the front 60 with the installation of an ARB or OX in mind. If I'm happy with the 35s and 4.56s I'll probably put an OX in the front 60 and call it a day... and continute to threaten the detroit with a new home! Building it is the fun for me now days. I don't offroad much anymore, But I love a capable truck.

j